Author Topic: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!  (Read 19726 times)  

Offline Not Here

  • Status: Scheherazade
  • *****
  • Posts: 1972
    • View Profile
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #25 on: October 01, 2012, 09:47:25 PM »
I just want to say that I hope this doesn't sour you on other artist on KB. I've worked with tons of authors who have had lots of luck with a variety of artists. Sorry to hear about your loss in money though. Maybe he will decide to pop in and set things right.  :-\ Although it's been quite a while since he's been a regular on here.

Best of luck to you. Oh and btw- my husband is a veteran and agreed about the guns. I wouldn't have had any idea but then, I'm not your target audience.  ;)

Offline DarkScribe

  • Status: Scheherazade
  • *****
  • Posts: 1465
  • Gender: Male
  • Australia
    • View Profile
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #26 on: October 01, 2012, 10:55:17 PM »
Yeah, let's spam both here and Ammy forums with the same post, and call someone who's apparently delivered the artwork (which you called 'great'), a 'scammer' because there's such a major difference between an MP-4 and an MP-10.
*rolls eyes*
I hope you pay the same sort of attention to line edits.

There is a GREAT deal of difference between the two weapons. If the correct weapon was clearly described in the initial brief then this is a major and unacceptable problem. If you wanted a Ferrari on the cover as it was related to the story-line, but you got a Lotus - would that be acceptable to you? The issue however seems to be lack of interest/communication on the part of the designer.

Would you like to roll your eyes again? You are so impressive when you do that.

Offline Shane Murray

  • Status: Arthur Conan Doyle
  • ****
  • Posts: 694
  • Gender: Male
  • Japan
    • View Profile
    • My Website
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #27 on: October 01, 2012, 11:02:10 PM »
I think you're barking up the wrong tree on this one Ann. I find the post below much more offensive.


Agreed.

Also, I don't think I made my point very well. What I should have said was that with the internet you won't need to be face to face with a person, so they can pull this sort of stuff a lot easier. In face to face dealings there are more consequences (i.e. a punch to the face :P). The internet can be a dangerous place to do business.

Offline Revolution

  • Status: Jane Austen
  • ***
  • Posts: 426
  • Gender: Male
  • Nowhere on this planet
    • View Profile
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #28 on: October 02, 2012, 04:48:04 AM »
The very section of kindleboards is for the writers.

And I am grateful any warning concerning dodgy cover artists, editors or anyone of the sort.


I will avoid him like the plague.
If at first you don't exceed, give up and find something easier. Simplify your life.

Offline Betsy the Quilter

  • To paraphrase Bill Murray in Groundhog Day: "I'm a goddess; not THE Goddess. I don't think."
  • Administrator
  • Status: Shakespeare
  • *****
  • Posts: 62814
  • Gender: Female
  • Alexandria, VA
  • Love all, moderate all, to quote my friend Harvey
    • View Profile
    • Betsy True Designs
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #29 on: October 02, 2012, 04:59:38 AM »
Just to clarify, as there seems to be some misunderstanding of Ann's original post here:  it's entirely appropriate to post negative experiences with people who provide author services, just as it is appropriate to post positive ones.  We just ask that people do so and discuss the issue in as reasoned and rational a way as possible, given the highly charged nature of the subject mattter.  Suggesting physical attacks, even in a humorous manner, is not something we like to see. 

As for Ian's post, which occured while Ann was composing one of hers--discussion of whether the kind of weapon was sufficient to reject the artwork is a valid discussion point; the manner in which the comment was made was probably over the line; I'm going to review the post and subsequent discussion.  The post has been well responded to at this point, including by Keith.  Let's not derail the original purpose of the thread by focussing too much on one response.

Continued discussion of Keith's original issue and posts about other people's experiences, good or bad, with Ronnell are entirely appropriate here as long as done civilly.

Thank you.

Betsy
KB Moderator
« Last Edit: October 02, 2012, 07:47:49 AM by Betsy the Quilter »
Goodreads Goal -- 75 books


Joined 10/27/2008  | Miss you, Harvey, Jeff & Dona!
Harvey Chute (1962-2015), KB Founder

Proud Owner: Oasis/Voyage/Touch/Basic/K1/Fire HDX
Betsy True Designs Facebook | My Store

Offline Lynn McNamee

  • Status: Dostoevsky
  • ******
  • Posts: 3987
  • Gender: Female
  • Carolinas
    • View Profile
    • Red Adept Publishing
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #30 on: October 02, 2012, 05:19:52 AM »
I don't think the reason for the author's problem with the artwork is really the issue.

No matter what problem the author had with the service, the artist should at least communicate and discuss. A compromise could have been reached. Sure, to some the type of weapon may seem frivolous, but in certain genres, it's a bigger deal. The artist could even have offered to do a different style cover where a weapon doesn't appear.

This complaint is not about the work done. It's about the lack of communication. And the OP has a valid complaint in my opinion.

As far as I am aware, the only times I have failed to respond to a client were when either his or her message or my response went to spam.

So the only thing I will ask the OP is if he has been checking his spam/junk folders in case a response went there.




Online Decon

  • Status: A A Milne
  • ******
  • Posts: 4241
    • View Profile
    • Declan Conner, Blog
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #31 on: October 02, 2012, 07:12:36 AM »
It would seem that images descriptions do matter to some readers. I can can recall a discussion post (not on here) where a number of posts discussed and complained of covers, particularly from indie authors, where say the picture of a woman or man had no resemblance to the characters as described in the book. As an example one cited something similar to --- a blond on the cover, but the character in the book had black hair.

I am a war book/soldier's story book fan and the wrong gun on in the hands of someone on the cover would matter to me. It would signal that maybe the book was by someone who didn't know what they were writing about with any degree of authenticity.

Provided the OP specified the requirement for a specific rifle, then his complaint about the image is justified. There is no excuse, other than illness or vacations for a lack of communication. Clearly now this thread has been posted, then the situation is obviously at the point of no return. I don't know which country in which the designer resides, but if he was in the UK, I would take him to the small claims court if it was not possible to resolve. If you paid by credit card, or by paypal, then I would make a claim to them for repayment if your card laws are the same as in the UK.


Girl at the Window: sample chapters for nomination on Kindle Scout.
Declan Conner | blog

Offline Hudson Owen

  • Status: Scheherazade
  • *****
  • Posts: 1752
  • Brooklyn, NY
    • View Profile
    • Hudson Owen's Blog
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #32 on: October 02, 2012, 07:23:40 AM »
I'll put in a good word for Ronnell based on my one cover with him.  I contacted him in late May or early June for a cover for my long story The Fight of the Century.  I paid $150 up front, which I did not like.  I had read no negative press about him, liked his imagination and decided to take a chance.  I outlined some ideas for the cover and put it on hold for an unexpected rewrite.  I let Ronnell know so that he could focus on other projects.

I turned the project back on and the artist, came up with a design in a reasonable period of time.  It wasn't exactly what I had imagined; but I liked it immediately, accepted it, and conveyed my happiness to the artist.  He included my cover in his portfolio (see signature).  I did ask for two minor edits: to increase the point size of my name, and to brighten the image overall.  The first edit he did immediately, the second he apparently balked at.  I waited a week and politely asked again, explaining that while the image was fine in full, it looked a bit dark in the thumbnail.  About a week after that he complied.

So, I have no beef with Ronnell D. Porter.  However, if he has upped his fee to $250, I might explore alternatives.

Offline T.L. Haddix

  • Status: A A Milne
  • ******
  • Posts: 4836
  • Gender: Female
  • Stick a fork in me, I'm done.
    • View Profile
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #33 on: October 02, 2012, 07:27:46 AM »
It would seem that images descriptions do matter to some readers. I can can recall a discussion post (not on here) where a number of posts discussed and complained of covers, particularly from indie authors, where say the picture of a woman or man had no resemblance to the characters as described in the book. As an example one cited something similar to --- a blond on the cover, but the character in the book had black hair.

I am a war book/soldier's story book fan and the wrong gun on in the hands of someone on the cover would matter to me. It would signal that maybe the book was by someone who didn't know what they were writing about with any degree of authenticity.

Provided the OP specified the requirement for a specific rifle, then his complaint about the image is justified. There is no excuse, other than illness or vacations for a lack of communication. Clearly now this thread has been posted, then the situation is obviously at the point of no return. I don't know which country in which the designer resides, but if he was in the UK, I would take him to the small claims court if it was not possible to resolve. If you paid by credit card, or by paypal, then I would make a claim to them for repayment if your card laws are the same as in the UK.

Bolded - Readers, especially readers in certain genres like romance, pay closer attention than you might think to cover accuracy. There have been a lot of blog posts where covers have been discussed because they're so far off from being accurate. Most of those discussions end up revolving around traditionally published books, though. That's one of the advantages self-published authors have over traditionally published folks, that we can be as accurate as possible on our covers. That's probably part of what is stinging the OP so badly.

Offline MJWare

  • Status: George Orwell
  • *****
  • Posts: 1994
    • View Profile
    • MJ Ware - Stories for Kids
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #34 on: October 02, 2012, 07:41:43 AM »
I have no idea what's going on with Ronnell, but I can say that I would be shocked to find he was deliberately taking money from people and not producing a cover.

Ronnell has done several covers for me without issue (though none recently). The one time I didn't like the concept he came up with, I offered to pay him 1/2 of his fee for his time and he refused it saying he hadn't done his job.

I do know, that he has very poor internet access, maybe, just maybe that's what's causing these issues. I know, given the time frame involved it seems like he could have made it to a library or something. Still, I just wanted to offer my experience with Ronnell as a counterpoint.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2012, 08:03:02 AM by MJAWare »

Offline 4eyesbooks

  • Status: Jane Austen
  • ***
  • Posts: 415
  • Gender: Female
  • Atlanta
    • View Profile
    • 4EYESBOOKS
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #35 on: October 02, 2012, 07:46:26 AM »
Jan,

I just hired Shayne Hellerman for my latest cover so glad to hear you were satisfied.  I also had Ronnell Porter on my possible cover artist list so I'll be removing that listing for future reference.

Angela Muse | 4EYESBOOKS | Facebook

Offline Jan Hurst-Nicholson

  • Status: Emily Dickinson
  • *******
  • Posts: 9673
  • Durban, South Africa
  • Don't let your emotions overpower your intellect
    • View Profile
    • www.just4kix.jimdo.com
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #36 on: October 02, 2012, 08:10:30 AM »
I don't know whether the OP did this, but it is advisable to keep checking the junk mail folder. I was waiting for a cover and discovered it had been in my junk mail for about 4 days  :P. There was also a time when a friend's email simply did not reach me and we couldn't figure out why. Despite re-uploading everything nothing came through. For a time we had to route our emails through another friend. However, if other people have also had a problem with this person it would appear that the junk mail folder is probably not the problem  ::)


Fiction, family saga, humour, short stories, teen, children's
Jan Hurst-Nicholson | author website

Offline Amanda Brice

  • Status: Edgar Allan Poe
  • *******
  • Posts: 5808
  • Gender: Female
  • Alexandria, VA
    • View Profile
    • Amanda Brice
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #37 on: October 02, 2012, 08:21:59 AM »
I do know, that he has very poor internet access, maybe, just maybe that's what's causing these issues.

I'm sorry, but that's really not an excuse. If he's going to be doing business on the internet -- which he obviously is -- then he has a responsibility to ensure he has proper internet access, whether at home or by going to the library/cafe with wireless/whatever.
 
Dance with danger - fall in love!
Amanda Brice | author website | facebook | youtube

Offline Jeff Shelby

  • Status: Lewis Carroll
  • **
  • Posts: 177
  • Gender: Male
  • Grapevine, TX
    • View Profile
    • Waves and Words
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #38 on: October 02, 2012, 08:24:43 AM »
Bolded - Readers, especially readers in certain genres like romance, pay closer attention than you might think to cover accuracy.

Absolutely agree. Gun enthusiasts are notorious for pointing out to authors when they have made even the most minor mistakes regarding weapons. I don't mean notorious in a negative way - they just pay attention to the most minute details related to weapons. It matters to them as readers. A mistake like that on a cover would absolutely matter to the OP's intended audience.

Offline MJWare

  • Status: George Orwell
  • *****
  • Posts: 1994
    • View Profile
    • MJ Ware - Stories for Kids
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #39 on: October 02, 2012, 08:28:24 AM »
I'm sorry, but that's really not an excuse. If he's going to be doing business on the internet -- which he obviously is -- then he has a responsibility to ensure he has proper internet access, whether at home or by going to the library/cafe with wireless/whatever.
Which is the reason for my next two sentences which you didn't quote: "I know, given the time frame involved it seems like he could have made it to a library or something. Still, I just wanted to offer my experience with Ronnell as a counterpoint."

I didn't see the other threads about Ronnell, so I really have no idea what's going on-- and I agree that it does seem very egregious, at least on the surface. I'm not defending him, just offering my experience--and frankly I wouldn't use him again myself until these outstanding complaints were resolved.

But we'd certainly feel bad if we learned that he was hit by a bus or something (except maybe the OP, who is out $250-j/k).
« Last Edit: October 02, 2012, 08:31:21 AM by MJAWare »

Offline Steve Silkin

  • Status: Scheherazade
  • *****
  • Posts: 1838
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
    • Books by Steve Silkin
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #40 on: October 02, 2012, 08:48:51 AM »
I have no idea what's going on with Ronnell, but I can say that I would be shocked to find he was deliberately taking money from people and not producing a cover.

I do know, that he has very poor internet access, maybe, just maybe that's what's causing these issues. I know, given the time frame involved it seems like he could have made it to a library or something. Still, I just wanted to offer my experience with Ronnell as a counterpoint.

In the previous case posted on KB, he did not return e-mail messages. Access or illness could have been the cause. Then the client used a different e-mail address and posed as someone placing an order. The e-mail was returned immediately.

Keith's case is not an isolated incident that can be written off to misunderstandings or other contretemps. It has several precedents.


Offline MeiLinMiranda

  • Status: Arthur C Clarke
  • *****
  • Posts: 2202
  • Gender: Female
  • Portland, OR
  • A gypsy queen in a fairy tale
    • View Profile
    • Meilin Miranda: Stories of Magic, Sex and Intrigue
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #41 on: October 02, 2012, 08:51:46 AM »
I'm married to a fan of military fiction; unsurprisingly, he's also a gun aficionado. Not a gun super freak, just someone who knows this stuff and finds accuracy important (not unusual among firearms people). He's fond of freeze framing movies and tv shows to see what the props department is up to, especially in SF films where they've altered stock guns. Would he notice the wrong gun on a book cover? In a heartbeat, and it would reflect quite poorly on the book inside, however unfairly. The OP is well within bounds to complain.

 
Stories of Magic, Sex and Intrigue
MeiLin Miranda | author website | facebook | twitter | goodreads | Blurb Doctor
No F's to Give in 2014

Offline jackz4000

  • Status: Arthur C Clarke
  • *****
  • Posts: 2819
    • View Profile
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #42 on: October 02, 2012, 11:19:29 AM »
One does not need to be a gun expert in telling apart the MP10 to the M4, they are totally different guns. Readers are usually quite knowledgeable about things that interest them and those who know guns can be especially brutal, just as Regency Romance readers can be. Don't know if the OP included his gun preference for the cover--but for $250 he got slip-shod service.

It's really important for the author to have good communication with the designer throughout the process. I don't think this is RP's first disappearing act.

Offline Victorine

  • Status: Isaac Asimov
  • ********
  • Posts: 10388
  • Gender: Female
  • Nebraska
    • View Profile
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #43 on: October 02, 2012, 11:39:31 AM »
Which is the reason for my next two sentences which you didn't quote: "I know, given the time frame involved it seems like he could have made it to a library or something. Still, I just wanted to offer my experience with Ronnell as a counterpoint."

I didn't see the other threads about Ronnell, so I really have no idea what's going on-- and I agree that it does seem very egregious, at least on the surface. I'm not defending him, just offering my experience--and frankly I wouldn't use him again myself until these outstanding complaints were resolved.

But we'd certainly feel bad if we learned that he was hit by a bus or something (except maybe the OP, who is out $250-j/k).

I totally understand what you're saying, MJ, and I am definitely the kind of person to give someone the benefit of the doubt. The only problem is with Ronnell, I've heard numerous stories all pretty much saying the same thing. He took money, either produced a cover that needed some tweaks and then never did them, or didn't ever produce covers and stopped emailing the people. The last time this happened, after many emails went unanswered, the guy emailed from a different account and pretended to be a new customer. He got an email in ten minutes.

This is not a random bus hitting incident. This is a pattern, and I do think it's okay to talk about it.

And I do think if someone wants to work with Ronnell, they should get their proof done first and then give him the money. An artist can put a watermark on a proof so they are sure to get paid for their work. There's nothing wrong with that.
Not What She Seems - A NYT's Bestseller

Now Available! Accidentally Married

Offline MaryMcDonald

  • Status: A A Milne
  • ******
  • Posts: 4291
    • View Profile
    • M.P. McDonald
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #44 on: October 02, 2012, 11:57:26 AM »
Sorry to hear you have had such a hard time. How frustrating! A couple of years ago, when Ronnell was just starting out, he offered to do some sample covers for some of us as a way for him to get his name out there. Things didn't work out for me when I took him up on the offer and he wasn't happy with me. (It was not a big involved cover. It was more like a stock photo he put some text on and the stock photo wasn't at all what I wanted.)

Anyway, I had the very opposite experience with Victorine.  ;D I bought one of her pre-made covers a few months back for a book I'm releasing this month. I asked for a few things tweaked and she not only did them, she literally did them in like, 15 minutes! And she was trying to go on vacation. I tried telling her there wasn't a rush (although, I admit, I was really excited to see the final cover--I would have waited.)

The Mark Taylor Series-Intense thrillers | CJ Sheridan Thrillers
M.P. McDonald | M.P. McDonald | Facebook | Amazon Author Page

Offline MJWare

  • Status: George Orwell
  • *****
  • Posts: 1994
    • View Profile
    • MJ Ware - Stories for Kids
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #45 on: October 02, 2012, 12:10:40 PM »
I totally understand what you're saying, MJ, and I am definitely the kind of person to give someone the benefit of the doubt. The only problem is with Ronnell, I've heard numerous stories all pretty much saying the same thing. He took money, either produced a cover that needed some tweaks and then never did them, or didn't ever produce covers and stopped emailing the people. The last time this happened, after many emails went unanswered, the guy emailed from a different account and pretended to be a new customer. He got an email in ten minutes.

This is not a random bus hitting incident. This is a pattern, and I do think it's okay to talk about it.
Yes, I agree it's fine to talk about. Frankly, I think Keith did the right thing by letting everyone know.

I also think it's fine to post my experiences, as long as I preface then by letting members know it's been a while.

At this point, I couldn't recommend him either and really hope no one got burned based on my past recommendation.

Offline JRTomlin

  • Status: Agatha Christie
  • *********
  • Posts: 16253
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
    • J. R. Tomlin on Writing and More
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #46 on: October 02, 2012, 12:28:38 PM »
It would seem that images descriptions do matter to some readers. I can can recall a discussion post (not on here) where a number of posts discussed and complained of covers, particularly from indie authors, where say the picture of a woman or man had no resemblance to the characters as described in the book. As an example one cited something similar to --- a blond on the cover, but the character in the book had black hair.

I am a war book/soldier's story book fan and the wrong gun on in the hands of someone on the cover would matter to me. It would signal that maybe the book was by someone who didn't know what they were writing about with any degree of authenticity.

Provided the OP specified the requirement for a specific rifle, then his complaint about the image is justified. There is no excuse, other than illness or vacations for a lack of communication. Clearly now this thread has been posted, then the situation is obviously at the point of no return. I don't know which country in which the designer resides, but if he was in the UK, I would take him to the small claims court if it was not possible to resolve. If you paid by credit card, or by paypal, then I would make a claim to them for repayment if your card laws are the same as in the UK.
These things do matter. Those of us who write war fiction go to some lengths to try to make our stories reflect the weapons used and many of us are very particular about covers. On my own cover of Countenance of War, the weapons and armorials were extensively researched by the artist.

I have exchanged at least a dozen emails with the artist working on the cover for my next novel. (For example, his concept art showed arrows and I immediately told him that archers didn't take part in that particular battle so they won't be in the final painting) Most of the emails were from him asking for my input and information. This is how it should be.

Except for emails going to spam, there is no excuse in my opinion for the lack of communication in this case. Even if the artist were going on vacation, he would have a responsibility to let his client know that he would not be available.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2012, 01:12:58 PM by JRTomlin »

Saor Alba
J. R. Tomlin | J. R. Tomlin | Writing and More

Offline swolf

  • Status: Edgar Allan Poe
  • *******
  • Posts: 6785
    • View Profile
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #47 on: October 02, 2012, 12:31:53 PM »
The last time this happened, after many emails went unanswered, the guy emailed from a different account and pretended to be a new customer. He got an email in ten minutes.

If that's true, and I have no reason to doubt it, then it speaks volumes.

Offline CaedemMarquez

  • Status: Arthur Conan Doyle
  • ****
  • Posts: 945
    • View Profile
    • Official Site for Author Caedem Marquez
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #48 on: October 02, 2012, 12:42:14 PM »
That name sounds so familiar! I know as soon as I find his avatar,  I will recognize him! I hope it isn't who I think it is.

Offline MJWare

  • Status: George Orwell
  • *****
  • Posts: 1994
    • View Profile
    • MJ Ware - Stories for Kids
Re: Do NOT use Ronnell D. Porter to design your book cover!
« Reply #49 on: October 02, 2012, 12:57:07 PM »
That name sounds so familiar! I know as soon as I find his avatar,  I will recognize him! I hope it isn't who I think it is.
It probably is and it's pretty disheartening. He's an old time KB member--even did some of Amanda's first covers way back when. It's certainly tough to hear!

Buy Scrivener for Windows or Mac