Author Topic: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords  (Read 93107 times)  

Offline KelliWolfe

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #150 on: January 04, 2015, 02:54:17 PM »
That keyword (actually key phrase) has 96 characters not counting spaces. So I guess you couldn't put in 7 keywords of that length if the limit is 350 - 400 characters.

I've never gotten to the point where the box tells me I've used up my full quota of keyword characters. How do we know what the actual limit is?


Philip
I've tested it manually. After 400 characters it won't accept any more and truncates whatever you paste in.

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Online Evenstar

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #151 on: January 04, 2015, 04:24:44 PM »
That keyword (actually key phrase) has 96 characters not counting spaces. So I guess you couldn't put in 7 keywords of that length if the limit is 350 - 400 characters.

I've never gotten to the point where the box tells me I've used up my full quota of keyword characters. How do we know what the actual limit is?


Philip

You are quite right, my strings aren't generally that long - all this was off the top of my head to demonstrate rather than actually copied from my keywords.

I usually keyword stuff until my quota is all gone. So the last one either ends up really short or really long depending on how wordy the previous ones were

Offline Someone

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #152 on: January 04, 2015, 04:51:53 PM »
Quote
One thing I'm not sure that I agree with is that word placement in the KDP textbox doesn't matter. When I search using different combinations of the same words, book placement in the search results varies The number of search results returned is identical in each case, but the books do show up in different orders within the results.

For example, if I search for "older man love story" and "love story older man" (logged out, searching in the Kindle Store) both return 818 results, but just scrolling down the first page you can quickly see that the books are returned in a different order. This effect seems magnified the further out in the search results the book appears.

I'm not sure whether the difference is enough to spend a lot of time worrying about it, but there does seem to be a difference.

Do NOT hesitate to add to the discussion. I'm not one of those people who focuses on being "right". I could care less about being "right"; IMO insistence on being "right" only leads to ignorance. In my world there is no "right" or "wrong"; there is just stuff to learn.

It's interesting you say that because it's something we would see and then we would see a lot of examples that would refute it. I can't say, off the top of my mind, if we ever ran something just to study order. I'll look back in my notes. Regardless of what my notes say, we run a bunch of different experiments and IMO anyone's conflicting experiences is a a good reason to run another one.

So I say we put order on the list. We select our experimental order we run on how we judge something's importance and, when it comes to keywords, this factor - order of keywords - is quite important IMO. I'll let ya know what we come back with - please bump me if I don't.

Everyone please keep in mind there is no way we can say, "we know this for sure" about anything. Everything is really just very experimented hypothesis. We can never say "for sure" but we don't just toss spaghetti and say, "we tested this and blah, blah, blah" either. We really run stuff through the mill before we conclude anything; we base our paychecks on it after all.

Offline Someone

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #153 on: January 04, 2015, 04:55:47 PM »
Phillip
Quote
I've never gotten to the point where the box tells me I've used up my full quota of keyword characters. How do we know what the actual limit is?
You'll know because it will just stop adding what you are typing into the box. Go in and type some phrase over and over again. You'll notice a point where you are typing but the box just don't seem to notice :)
« Last Edit: January 04, 2015, 05:13:16 PM by Someone »

Offline JessieCar

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #154 on: January 04, 2015, 04:55:58 PM »
Thank you very much for the book, Someone - will be reading it soon! (When not sleepy).

The changes I have made so far do seem to have produced more downloads of my permafree book.

I was wondering whether, if you do a search using keywords while logged in, the search engine reflects this by producing books it determines of interest to you (like your own book?).
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Offline jakedfw

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #155 on: January 04, 2015, 05:53:27 PM »
re. character limit

I just tested this. The character limit is 400, but note that this includes the spaces between the words you use. So if you have a lot of words, the spaces really add up to fill up the space.

For example, if you have 51 words, that's 50 spaces, or 12.5% of the total characters you have access to.

Offline Jan Hurst-Nicholson

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #156 on: January 05, 2015, 12:17:44 AM »
At the bottom of the search page it asks 'did you find what you were looking for?" and then asks for a comment on the search. I wonder if it makes any difference if readers answer 'yes' to that particular string of search words  :-\

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Offline Jan Hurst-Nicholson

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #157 on: January 05, 2015, 12:28:59 AM »
Just seen this in a book TITLE  :o

Spread Wide Baby I Know Your Secret: Hot Girl Taboo Lusty Hotwife Horny Woman Erotic Free Romance Husband wife Body Love Short Erotica Fiction Story Book


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Offline Someone

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #158 on: January 05, 2015, 12:29:28 AM »
Whoever left this one star review:
Quote
Books like these drive me nuts. I got it for free but it's normally priced at 3 dollars. Think about that: 3 dollars for a 30 page ebook. But putting price aside: Here is a book purporting to have the secrets of keywords for promotions. Who are the authors? What are their credentials and proof of success? You won't find any of that information on the cover or in the book as they have seemed to want to be anonymous. The information contained within the book and is nothing new. You're better off searching amazon for the phrase "Amazon Keywords" and finding a more established book out of the many who have covered this topic.

Finally, this book was not edited. There are so many grammatical errors it's atrocious. How far in do you need to go? The header of the very first section: "THE IMPORTANT BUT OVERRLOOKED THING CALLED KEYWORDS". Seriously, you couldn't dream up a joke like overlooking the word overlook. There were far more grammatical errors making this book hard to follow.

Whoomp there it is - TYPICAL KB
I don't know why I am surprised or miffed about it. Probably because this is so TYPICAL of this place. Someone doing this while they are using the time people graciously go out of their way to give them. I knew there were typos in it. I said as much; said it straight out and why they weren't addressed. But when this post came up, I could have thought about the typos and said, "Ohh, gotta scrub it before I offer something on-topic that can help people in case people wanna go TYPICAL KB." But I didn't. Instead I went in, made it free ASAP, and posted I did so. You know, the un-typical KB kinda thing that so many people wish there was more of in this place...
That is what steams me so. This kind of stuff makes people not want to offer anything helpful. It is just mean.
Whatever.

You're welcome. I sure hope since it contains a joke you couldn't dream up, you don't use any of our research. None. Of. It. 
But you will. You will.
And you will because what you claim is in all the keyword books isn't out there at all.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2015, 12:48:02 AM by Someone »

Online Evenstar

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #159 on: January 05, 2015, 01:01:43 AM »
Whoever left this one star review:
Whoomp there it is - TYPICAL KB
I don't know why I am surprised or miffed about it. Probably because this is so TYPICAL of this place. Someone doing this while they are using the time people graciously go out of their way to give them. I knew there were typos in it. I said as much; said it straight out and why they weren't addressed. But when this post came up, I could have thought about the typos and said, "Ohh, gotta scrub it before I offer something on-topic that can help people in case people wanna go TYPICAL KB." But I didn't. Instead I went in, made it free ASAP, and posted I did so. You know, the un-typical KB kinda thing that so many people wish there was more of in this place...
That is what steams me so. This kind of stuff makes people not want to offer anything helpful. It is just mean.
Whatever.

You're welcome. I sure hope since it contains a joke you couldn't dream up, you don't use any of our research. None. Of. It. 
But you will. You will.
And you will because what you claim is in all the keyword books isn't out there at all.

Oh my goodness! That is awful! And so undeserved. I've downloaded a copy, I have not had a chance to look at it yet, but if it is half as helpful as the others suggest then I think pretty much everyone on this thread has benefited. Let's not allow one bad apple to taint the whole barrel. I am sure that the good people on KB's will rally round and see to it that you get a bunch of five star reviews to off-set this one negative person, I know I will.

Offline Mercia McMahon

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #160 on: January 05, 2015, 01:05:29 AM »
Someone doing this while they are using the time people graciously go out of their way to give them.

Why did you one star your own book?  :P
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Offline Jan Hurst-Nicholson

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #161 on: January 05, 2015, 01:10:27 AM »
Whoever left this one star review:
Whoomp there it is - TYPICAL KB
I don't know why I am surprised or miffed about it. Probably because this is so TYPICAL of this place. Someone doing this while they are using the time people graciously go out of their way to give them. I knew there were typos in it. I said as much; said it straight out and why they weren't addressed. But when this post came up, I could have thought about the typos and said, "Ohh, gotta scrub it before I offer something on-topic that can help people in case people wanna go TYPICAL KB." But I didn't. Instead I went in, made it free ASAP, and posted I did so. You know, the un-typical KB kinda thing that so many people wish there was more of in this place...
That is what steams me so. This kind of stuff makes people not want to offer anything helpful. It is just mean.
Whatever.

You're welcome. I sure hope since it contains a joke you couldn't dream up, you don't use any of our research. None. Of. It. 
But you will. You will.
And you will because what you claim is in all the keyword books isn't out there at all.

That's maddening  >:(. I've left a review, but it's not showing yet.
ETA now showing  :)
« Last Edit: January 05, 2015, 01:19:48 AM by Jan Hurst-Nicholson »

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #162 on: January 05, 2015, 01:21:04 AM »
Just seen this in a book TITLE  :o

Spread Wide Baby I Know Your Secret: Hot Girl Taboo Lusty Hotwife Horny Woman Erotic Free Romance Husband wife Body Love Short Erotica Fiction Story Book

I wonder what that book's about, then.

Offline oakwood

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #163 on: January 05, 2015, 01:37:03 AM »
A big thanks to OP and everyone for the thread!

If I had to choose between being discoverable and being prolific I would choose the first every time.

During my years as an internet marketer doing cpa campaigns and building affiliate sites there was a lot of different views on how to reach xxx per day. One was blasting a niche with cookie cutter sites and gaining hits simply by being prolific. The other focused greatly on analysis of search engine results and wedging into the first page for specific keywords.

"Profitable keywords" became more interesting than "profitable markets/niches" simply because targeting people with their CC in hand you could get the same (or better) returns with less work. It didn't always work and Google kept shifting the goalposts but looking back, being found by interested visitors rather than blanketing a market still delivers better yields. (just my stats, YMMV)

The upside is that reaching more targeted buyers instead of casting a wide net to browsers, you can (often) price your product higher which in turn means you are ok selling less units (or making bank selling same levels, etc).

Amazon's algos may work in a different manner but perhaps conversion is also a ranking factor and if so, being purchased by a few highly targeted may outweigh being bought by through somewhat irrelevant searches? Just a thought.

Good thread! Interesting topic!

Offline Jena H

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #164 on: January 05, 2015, 03:31:08 AM »
Whoever left this one star review:
Whoomp there it is - TYPICAL KB
I don't know why I am surprised or miffed about it. Probably because this is so TYPICAL of this place. Someone doing this while they are using the time people graciously go out of their way to give them. I knew there were typos in it. I said as much; said it straight out and why they weren't addressed. But when this post came up, I could have thought about the typos and said, "Ohh, gotta scrub it before I offer something on-topic that can help people in case people wanna go TYPICAL KB." But I didn't. Instead I went in, made it free ASAP, and posted I did so. You know, the un-typical KB kinda thing that so many people wish there was more of in this place...
That is what steams me so. This kind of stuff makes people not want to offer anything helpful. It is just mean.
Whatever.

You're welcome. I sure hope since it contains a joke you couldn't dream up, you don't use any of our research. None. Of. It. 
But you will. You will.
And you will because what you claim is in all the keyword books isn't out there at all.

How do you know this is from someone on KBoards?   ???
Jena

Offline KelliWolfe

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #165 on: January 05, 2015, 05:31:42 AM »
Regardless of whether it was someone from here or not, the review was flat-out wrong. The specifics discussed in the book are simply not in any of the other books on KDP keywords out there.

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Offline Jan Hurst-Nicholson

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #166 on: January 05, 2015, 05:47:15 AM »
The book has now hit the top #100 in two categories.  :)

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Offline crow.bar.beer

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #167 on: January 05, 2015, 06:19:07 AM »
Why did you one star your own book?  :P

 ;D

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #168 on: January 05, 2015, 06:32:47 AM »
Thank you! Wonderful post.
 
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Offline Someone

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #169 on: January 05, 2015, 08:49:26 AM »
I really, really appreciate all the positive response. I can't tell you how down that review made me - even on a "book" I don't care about. I think it was because about other baggage in life I am carrying around right now. I'm the one in the family that bails everyone out and then, if I want to be paid back... Well you know how that goes.
I know. Off topic baggage. It just hit at the wrong time, you know?
But thank you very much. As completely crazy as it sounds to say, you made me feel A LOT better.

P.S. Yes. I am finally taking my mother's advice and getting better at saying no. A little better anyway.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2015, 08:52:10 AM by Someone »

Offline Rick Gualtieri

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #170 on: January 05, 2015, 08:58:43 AM »
I gave the book a read.  Some eye-opening stuff...especially about not wanting to give up the security blanket of comma-usage (too true!). 

Giving it a test run on 2 books right now.  Will monitor for a few weeks and see if there's any change. 

Thanks!


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Offline Cherise

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #171 on: January 05, 2015, 09:04:12 AM »

I was wondering whether, if you do a search using keywords while logged in, the search engine reflects this by producing books it determines of interest to you (like your own book?).



I think this is likely the case.

Offline KelliWolfe

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #172 on: January 05, 2015, 09:04:35 AM »
So, on the cover it says "Volume #1." That implies that there will be a Volume #2. Care to give us any hints?

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Offline Claire Frank

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #173 on: January 05, 2015, 09:04:42 AM »
I gave the book a read.  Some eye-opening stuff...especially about not wanting to give up the security blanket of comma-usage (too true!). 

Giving it a test run on 2 books right now.  Will monitor for a few weeks and see if there's any change. 

Thanks!

I'm sure we'd all love to hear what happens!

Whoever left this one star review:
Whoomp there it is - TYPICAL KB
I don't know why I am surprised or miffed about it. Probably because this is so TYPICAL of this place. Someone doing this while they are using the time people graciously go out of their way to give them. I knew there were typos in it. I said as much; said it straight out and why they weren't addressed. But when this post came up, I could have thought about the typos and said, "Ohh, gotta scrub it before I offer something on-topic that can help people in case people wanna go TYPICAL KB." But I didn't. Instead I went in, made it free ASAP, and posted I did so. You know, the un-typical KB kinda thing that so many people wish there was more of in this place...
That is what steams me so. This kind of stuff makes people not want to offer anything helpful. It is just mean.
Whatever.

You're welcome. I sure hope since it contains a joke you couldn't dream up, you don't use any of our research. None. Of. It. 
But you will. You will.
And you will because what you claim is in all the keyword books isn't out there at all.

Super lame. I'm sorry you got hit with that. I hope it wasn't someone from here, but maybe that's just my wishful thinking. I, for one, think it was awesome that you shared this info and I appreciate the time you took to put it together, as well as the fact that you were willing to share it with us for free.

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Offline Jan Hurst-Nicholson

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Re: Evenstar's Monster Post on Amazon Keywords
« Reply #174 on: January 05, 2015, 09:05:02 AM »
Someone - glad you are feeling better  :).

In case this is of use to anyone, this is the result of my keyword changes. I used the search phrases that seemed to be popular. I have to say I agree with a previous poster that it makes sense for 'erotica' to have a separate place. If I had been searching with a child I would have been mortified when the erotica books showed up.

The book is Mystery at Ocean Drive (a teen action adventure). I used Hardy Boys style in the blurb.

"hardy boys" 38 results. Page 12
"nancy drew" 636 results. Page 21
"action adventure teenagers" 486 results. Page 1
"Boys mystery books"  5,278 results. Too much erotica gave up looking.
"mystery books for teens" 2,916 results. Too much erotica gave up looking.
"mystery detective books 81,183 results. Too many to trawl through
"mystery detective books for teens" 954 results. Page 7
"radio control helicopter" 26 results. Page 1
"RC model helicopter" 17 results. Page 1 (but a bit lower down the page)
"books about surfing" 28 results. Nothing
"surfing" 1,054 results. page 12
"teen books surfing" 33 results. page 1
"teen girl books surfing" 3 results. first one
"teen boy books surfing" 3 results. Second one
"gift ideas for teen boys" 44 results. page 2
"gift ideas for teen girls" 82 results. page 5

Now waiting to see if it makes any difference to sales  ::)

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