Need Perfect Gift? Shop Amazon Gift Cards. Any Occasion.

Author Topic: KU 3  (Read 35129 times)  

Offline DanaFraser

  • Status: Lewis Carroll
  • **
  • Posts: 221
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #25 on: August 01, 2017, 08:04:48 AM »
I had already noticed that my page reads had been much higher than usual for this early in the day.  Depending on if they change how they pay for them, I could grow to really like KU 3.0...

Mine, too. Makes me wonder how many were not being counted before.

Offline DanaFraser

  • Status: Lewis Carroll
  • **
  • Posts: 221
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #26 on: August 01, 2017, 08:06:14 AM »
Obviously KDP is NOT going to admit to any shortcomings in the KU 2.0 system, so the fuzzy description is deliberate.  Whether anything worthwhile has changed remains to be seen, viz.: 1)  The page-skip vs. pages-read issue; 2)  The exit point issue; 3)  The problem with scam books and stuffed books

Unless these issues have been addressed, this is just applying lipstick to a pig.

For GoT fans, it's applying Dornish lipstick to a pig :D

Offline lyndabelle

  • Status: Arthur Conan Doyle
  • ****
  • Posts: 734
  • Gender: Female
  • California
    • View Profile
    • Lynda Belle's Blog/Website
Re: KU 3
« Reply #27 on: August 01, 2017, 08:08:04 AM »
Wow! Talk about on the ball. Email hasn't even been out 5 minutes, and already two pages on a thread.

Looking it over, it is nice to see Amazon trying to make things more fair. From my understanding from reading the KU 3.0 on the KDP page, shorts, or any book length up to 3,000, are only paid once. I don't think reading a short over and over, and some of my readers do like to read certain parts over and over ;-), is going to give more pages reads. Sounds like it will only still be counting once. But large stuffed books may be over, and they are counting per customer. Sounds like the pirates might have to hook up more devices to keep up. I mean, they'll figure a way to get around it, but at least Amazon is doing something.

« Last Edit: August 01, 2017, 08:09:39 AM by lyndabelle »

Lynda Belle | Website | Amazon Author Page

Offline Stewart Matthews

  • Status: Jane Austen
  • ***
  • Posts: 290
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #28 on: August 01, 2017, 08:09:37 AM »
I picked a hell of a day to release a new book.
 

Offline alawston

  • Status: Arthur C Clarke
  • *****
  • Posts: 2724
  • Gender: Male
  • London
  • London-based writer and actor
    • View Profile
    • Andrew K Lawston's intermittent blogular adventures
Re: KU 3
« Reply #29 on: August 01, 2017, 08:11:36 AM »
No changes to my KENPC numbers as far as I can see (though on one particularly short pen name book, it does warn me that the SRL may mean I get much lower than the KENPC figure for readthroughs, which is nice).

The email is a bit vague, probably deliberately. I went back almost all-in to KU in June after a long time away. July's reads were good to me, so I'll see how this pans out, and what effect, if any, this change has on the page rate for July... the 15th is going to be an interesting day for a lot of writers, I suspect.


Broadly comic writer working across as many genres as he can. Acting done.
Andrew Lawston | Facebook | Twitter

Offline Germanikus

  • Status: Dr. Seuss
  • *
  • Posts: 41
    • View Profile
    • raphaelmoreau.com
Re: KU 3
« Reply #30 on: August 01, 2017, 08:13:37 AM »
Looking at the KENPC-numbers of my books I see a drop of around 10-15 %. Sad day for me if the numbers stay the same on average for all publishers. Just lucky that sales are the majority of my earnings.


Germanikus | blog

Offline Stewart Matthews

  • Status: Jane Austen
  • ***
  • Posts: 290
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #31 on: August 01, 2017, 08:14:08 AM »
No changes to my KENPC numbers as far as I can see (though on one particularly short pen name book, it does warn me that the SRL may mean I get much lower than the KENPC figure for readthroughs, which is nice).

The email is a bit vague, probably deliberately. I went back almost all-in to KU in June after a long time away. July's reads were good to me, so I'll see how this pans out, and what effect, if any, this change has on the page rate for July... the 15th is going to be an interesting day for a lot of writers, I suspect.

My guess is it'll take some time to roll out the new changes. There are 6 million (?) books on Kindle Press, and how many in KU? Having to recalculate KENPC for every KU book is a big job. Probably quite a few books haven't been touched. My bet is Amazon will crunch through most of them by Monday.
 

Offline alawston

  • Status: Arthur C Clarke
  • *****
  • Posts: 2724
  • Gender: Male
  • London
  • London-based writer and actor
    • View Profile
    • Andrew K Lawston's intermittent blogular adventures
Re: KU 3
« Reply #32 on: August 01, 2017, 08:15:02 AM »
My guess is it'll take some time to roll out the new changes. There are 6 million (?) books on Kindle Press, and how many in KU? Having to recalculate KENPC for every KU book is a big job. Probably quite a few books haven't been touched. My bet is Amazon will crunch through most of them by the Monday.

Possibly, but all the books I checked had KENPC v.3.0 in front of them, so I have to assume mine have been done.


Broadly comic writer working across as many genres as he can. Acting done.
Andrew Lawston | Facebook | Twitter

Offline RBN

  • Status: Jane Austen
  • ***
  • Posts: 449
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #33 on: August 01, 2017, 08:15:44 AM »
There's a Wayback Machine save for the 2.0 terms dated July 3, 2017. The 3,000-page cap was pre-existing. The only thing that's substantially changed is "2.0" has become "3.0."

My KENPCs got a slight downward adjustment months ago. They haven't changed at all today. Unless Amazon has improved/worsened backend issues they don't specify in these terms, it looks like business as usual to me.

Offline Holden

  • Status: Dr. Seuss
  • *
  • Posts: 6
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #34 on: August 01, 2017, 08:18:16 AM »
Yep; I suspect they're cracking down on the folks that use links at the start of books to jump to the back of the book to make it look like they've read the whole thing and register all the pages read. Given that Amazon has the ability to tell how far we've read in a book, it wouldn't surprise me that they can track which pages in a book have been read/accessed and which haven't or been skipped.

it's a start. doesn't solve click farms and whatnot, but definitely makes their job at scamming a lot more tedious.

Offline Becca Fanning

  • Status: Dr. Seuss
  • *
  • Posts: 47
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #35 on: August 01, 2017, 08:19:22 AM »

Amazon has already stripped out the "non-linear reading" sentence mentioned in the prior page.

Becca Fanning

Offline P.T. Phronk

  • Status: Jane Austen
  • ***
  • Posts: 461
  • Gender: Male
  • London, Ontario
    • View Profile
    • Phronk.com
Re: KU 3
« Reply #36 on: August 01, 2017, 08:22:16 AM »
I'll just throw in the usual reminder that if everyone's page counts change by the same amount, we all get exactly the same payout per book as we did under KU 2. Even if everyone's page counts got cut in half. Exact same amount. It's a pot that split up, not a set per-page payout.

(I know there are nuances, but that's still basically how it works, so I really don't care at all if my page counts go down (or up). It's an arbitrary number that really only matters if you're trying to find loopholes to get more than your rightful share.)

Offline great_gazoo

  • Status: Dr. Seuss
  • *
  • Posts: 30
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #37 on: August 01, 2017, 08:22:52 AM »
Yep; I suspect they're cracking down on the folks that use links at the start of books to jump to the back of the book to make it look like they've read the whole thing and register all the pages read. Given that Amazon has the ability to tell how far we've read in a book, it wouldn't surprise me that they can track which pages in a book have been read/accessed and which haven't or been skipped.

It is simply not possible for Amazon to determine the exact number of pages read. Why? Because we can read with internet connection turned off.

Let's say I go to the beach with no internet connection and read 300 pages. Then I turn my internet back on when I'm home and Amazon will see that I left off at 300 pages. But what if, when my internet is off, I skip from chapter 2 to chapter 10 and still end up on page 300. When my internet is back on I'll still be at page 300.

Because we can read on kindle devices with no internet, it is simply impossible for Amazon to accurately determine the number of pages that have been read and not skipped over.

Offline David J Normoyle

  • Status: Arthur Conan Doyle
  • ****
  • Posts: 811
    • View Profile
    • David J Normoyle
Re: KU 3
« Reply #38 on: August 01, 2017, 08:26:20 AM »
It is simply not possible for Amazon to determine the exact number of pages read. Why? Because we can read with internet connection turned off.

Not necessarily. The kindle device could record pages read while offline, and report all the data whenever the kindle goes online again.


David J. Normoyle | website | facebook

Offline Desmond X. Torres

  • Status: Arthur Conan Doyle
  • ****
  • Posts: 847
  • Gender: Male
  • Kingston, Ontario Canada
  • Transplant from The Bronx to Canada
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #39 on: August 01, 2017, 08:27:45 AM »
Amazon has already stripped out the "non-linear reading" sentence mentioned in the prior page.
What the? You're right...
Crawley House: A tale of The Hauntings of Kingston

If you're new and need some guidance on setting up Mailchimp, I have a thread on it here at Kboards:http://www.kboards.com/index.php?topic=165780.msg2374500#msg2374500

Offline Cassie Leigh

  • Status: Scheherazade
  • *****
  • Posts: 1407
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #40 on: August 01, 2017, 08:28:49 AM »
I have seven books in KU right now, one seems to have dropped about 10% (a romance novel that's my most-borrowed), one has gone up to about where it was under KU 1.0 (a fantasy novel), the others have stayed the same. But I also moved everything to Vellum recently and that could've change my KENPCs then.


8 Pen Names. Genres: Non-fiction, Speculative Fiction, Romance.
Blog

Offline Holden

  • Status: Dr. Seuss
  • *
  • Posts: 6
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #41 on: August 01, 2017, 08:29:22 AM »
Amazon has already stripped out the "non-linear reading" sentence mentioned in the prior page.

yikes.

Offline great_gazoo

  • Status: Dr. Seuss
  • *
  • Posts: 30
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #42 on: August 01, 2017, 08:31:18 AM »
Not necessarily. The kindle device could record pages read while offline, and report all the data whenever the kindle goes online again.

Clearly for the past several years that has not been the case. Kindle devices have not been capable of doing that... because it hasn't done it at all under 2.0.

Maybe new devices can do that. Brand new ones that are just coming out. But obviously old ones up unti now  can't do that because the system has never fully counted page reads.

Offline pwtucker

  • Status: Arthur Conan Doyle
  • ****
  • Posts: 582
  • Gender: Male
  • Asheville, NC
    • View Profile
    • TransientMe
Re: KU 3
« Reply #43 on: August 01, 2017, 08:31:56 AM »
A little disheartening to have them making such major edits to their verbiage so soon after releasing their update. Doesn't speak for an organized roll-out.

Offline Desmond X. Torres

  • Status: Arthur Conan Doyle
  • ****
  • Posts: 847
  • Gender: Male
  • Kingston, Ontario Canada
  • Transplant from The Bronx to Canada
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #44 on: August 01, 2017, 08:32:17 AM »
yikes.
I'm not worried, really. I'm positive that what they're doing right now is editing the statement to give it more clarity of course. Wouldn't want to be vague, y'know?  :P
Crawley House: A tale of The Hauntings of Kingston

If you're new and need some guidance on setting up Mailchimp, I have a thread on it here at Kboards:http://www.kboards.com/index.php?topic=165780.msg2374500#msg2374500

Offline Atlantisatheart

  • Status: Jane Austen
  • ***
  • Posts: 322
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #45 on: August 01, 2017, 08:34:49 AM »
I don't remember this stuff being in there before, but sounds like they're at least paying lip service to monitoring things against scammers and stuffers.

'We do not permit authors to offer, or participate in marketing that incentivizes Kindle Unlimited or Kindle Owners' Lending Library customers to read their books in exchange for compensation of any kind. This includes payment (whether in the form of money or gift certificates), bonus content, entry to a contest or sweepstakes, discounts on future purchases, extra product, or other gifts. '


So the stuffers got stuffed. I wonder how many books are being rush-stripped of content as we speak. Hope nobody needs to upload a book over the next few days.

My KENP are up, but they all went up last time as well. This is good news because the pot might be fixed, but if the stuffers are taking out the extra pages and our pages are going up then theoretically we all should take home more. Or do I have my rose coloured glasses on?

Offline Piano Jenny

  • Status: Jane Austen
  • ***
  • Posts: 284
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #46 on: August 01, 2017, 08:39:52 AM »
The KENPC numbers under KU 3 are running at least 20% lower for me than KU 2. Not happy with the way they keep reducing pages AND pot.

And mine went up slightly. Huh? Does anybody have any idea how they are calculating this?

Professional Pianist and Author
Jennifer McCoy Blaske | Website

Offline Sam Rivers

  • Status: Arthur C Clarke
  • *****
  • Posts: 2372
  • Gender: Male
  • Planet Earth
  • Sci Fi Writer
    • View Profile
Re: KU 3
« Reply #47 on: August 01, 2017, 08:44:33 AM »
Quote
I think it's time I consider pulling out. The page-reads haven't been spectacular for a while, but it's been getting steadily worse for the last two months. While this new change doesn't make a lot of sense to me, it doesn't seem a great change, either. And since one gets 'locked in' for 3 months once joining, and my 'out date' is almost here, seems logical to do it now, rather than wait another three months to see what this all turns out to be.

Since D2D now has Overdrive getting out of KU3 makes sense. I just got an e-mail this morning to that effect and immediately put all my books in overdrive.  Now my books will show up in local libraries which is what I have always wanted.
 
Everything is theoretically impossible, until it is done.

Robert A. Heinlein

Offline David J Normoyle

  • Status: Arthur Conan Doyle
  • ****
  • Posts: 811
    • View Profile
    • David J Normoyle
Re: KU 3
« Reply #48 on: August 01, 2017, 08:45:37 AM »
Clearly for the past several years that has not been the case. Kindle devices have not been capable of doing that... because it hasn't done it at all under 2.0.

Maybe new devices can do that. Brand new ones that are just coming out. But obviously old ones up unti now  can't do that because the system has never fully counted page reads.

Agreed that they haven't accurately counted pages in the past. We have no idea if devices are capable of it, just that it's likely not trivial. I'm just pointing out that the lack of a constant internet connection doesn't make accurate page counts impossible.


David J. Normoyle | website | facebook

Offline Rick Gualtieri

  • Status: A A Milne
  • ******
  • Posts: 4648
  • Gender: Male
  • NJ
  • Renaissance Geek
    • View Profile
    • RickGualtieri.com
Re: KU 3
« Reply #49 on: August 01, 2017, 08:49:05 AM »
So far seems like business as usual on my books.  Page lengths seem to be unchanged, and page reads are in line with prior days.

Fingers crossed this dissuades the stuffers, scammers, and click farmers, but the cynic in me knows they'll just keep digging until they find some new loophole.


Making fantasy fun again, one corpse at a time
Rick Gualtieri | Website | Twitter | Facebook | Bill The Vampire on Facebook | YouTube