Author Topic: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...  (Read 9308 times)  

Offline loraininflorida

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #50 on: October 12, 2017, 05:44:06 PM »
I know I'm the lone voice in the wilderness here, but as I wasn't interested in Expanded Distribution, I switched all my books over from Createspace to KDP Print a while back and have been very happy with it. The only thing bad I found was the no-proof-copy thing, which they have now rectified. Okay, don't all descend at once!  :'(

https://kdp.amazon.com/en_US/help/topic/G202132360

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #51 on: October 12, 2017, 05:51:33 PM »
Yeah, I dont think the actual estore closing is going to effect many of us, beyond tumbling Mark's entire operation, it sounds like. But I do think it's the beginning of the end. How long til they stop allowing author copies? Or expanded distribution? How long til CreateSpace doesn't exist at all and it's KDP paperbacks and that's it (between the two, I mean)? Whichever one of the two you chose to use, soon the choice will be taken from you. You'll have to use KDP or switch to a pay to play like IngramSpark. It's another choice taken off the table. Another option taken away. Whether you used to choose to use it or not- soon you won't even have that choice.
Also makes me wonder what changes are in store for Goodreads.

Offline SugarBear57

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #52 on: October 12, 2017, 05:54:56 PM »
Lora, I hadn't heard about that! I followed their directions on how to do it, and it hasn't been rolled out to my KDP account yet. I'm really looking forward to it.

IngramSpark is not as terrible as it used to be. Nook Press is still free, if you don't mind tangling with extremely ineffective author support. There are other options if you're willing to learn new systems.

Offline djproctor

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #53 on: October 12, 2017, 05:58:02 PM »
I've worked with Lulu.com for over ten years, and have set up books there available by direct download only to provide at cost or discounted books. So that could be one option. There is also Publishers Graphics, which I haven't worked with in several years just because I changed how I do some things, but they are great and now offer even more services than when I worked with them in the past. They don't have setup fees, or at least didn't use to.

Online Lorri Moulton

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #54 on: October 12, 2017, 06:20:53 PM »
If Createspace goes out of business, do all the ISBNs they have filed for authors' works revert to Amazon? 

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Offline Mark Gardner

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #55 on: October 12, 2017, 06:23:42 PM »
I've worked with Lulu.com for over ten years, and have set up books there available by direct download only to provide at cost or discounted books. So that could be one option. There is also Publishers Graphics, which I haven't worked with in several years just because I changed how I do some things, but they are great and now offer even more services than when I worked with them in the past. They don't have setup fees, or at least didn't use to.

I checked out Lulu. They're much more expensive than CS, and they don't offer 5x8"

Offline Mark Gardner

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #56 on: October 12, 2017, 06:25:20 PM »
If Createspace goes out of business, do all the ISBNs they have filed for authors' works revert to Amazon? 
i don't think so. Since ISBNs can't be reused, and since the individual ISBN is linked to a specific book/size/binding, and registered with the LoC, they can only link to your book.

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #57 on: October 12, 2017, 07:11:23 PM »
Thanks, Mark.

I plan to buy ISBNs for my fictional books, but have considered using Amazon ISBNs for my non-fiction.

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #58 on: October 12, 2017, 09:06:25 PM »
Well, well, well. my idea is looking a little less crazy now, isn't it?

http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,255439.msg3559440.html#msg3559440
« Last Edit: October 12, 2017, 11:34:27 PM by jdcore »

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #59 on: October 12, 2017, 09:34:20 PM »
Ingram Spark is waiving their setup fee thru Nov 30 with code INDIEFRINGE17

Lets you load as many books as you want. Good time to switch if you want to.

Even better: 'Upload your book for free and get free revisions on your book between November 1, 2017 - March 31, 2018 with promo code "NANO17".'  :-)

Also never used the eStore myself, but *ouch* for those who did.  That's a serious blow to some business models and a painful one :-( 

It does seem like a sign that the merge of CS into KDP Print is likely to happen sometime in 2018.  I've always used Ingram for all non-Amazon print stuff, so I'm less concerned about the lack of expanded with KDP Print...but the lack of author copies and whether KDP Print will continue to stupidity with barcodes that CS started is another matter.

If Createspace goes out of business, do all the ISBNs they have filed for authors' works revert to Amazon? 

If you mean the free and the former $10 ones, Amazon has always owned them.  So authors never had any rights to them anyway, hence why you weren't allowed to take them to another printer.  The $99 ones were done through Bowker on the author's behalf and should already belong fully to that author.

Offline alawston

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #60 on: October 13, 2017, 01:21:33 AM »
Ingram are positioning themselves to compete directly with Amazon on POD - I have a voucher code for free set-ups from a publishing event I attended last month, and I suspect that such codes will be raining like candy in the not too distant future. They have an ex-Createspace director on board who knows the market. Createspace's days are numbered, because it's a muddled halfway house with a website that's not been updated in at least 4 years. Amazon hope that by bringing their paperback offering in-house and offering everything through a single dashboard as they do with KDP print, they can see off the challenge.


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Offline TwistedTales

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #61 on: October 13, 2017, 03:07:19 AM »
Were looking into Lulu and Ingram, each have plus and negative points. In the end, it looks like well pay more for set up and wholesale copies than we did with CreateSpace (as it stands today versus how Amazon will abuse the model later once they get control of this piece as well).

My take on this is:

I need to build in the real costs of doing business. If I dont then my margins become dependant on a false cost base, then Im stuck with the service provider giving me the apparently cheap deal. When they change the costs or payment model (like Amazon have done with ACX and KU this year) then my margins are screwed up.

Id rather work with a print provider who is charging a price that keeps them in business as well. What they add to my cost base is the right price, which will usually slowly increase over time, but I can gradually change the cost of my books to match.

Whenever you work with a false view of costs in a business (which is what weve been doing in KU, ACX and CreateSpace) you dont set your product/book pricing to match the real costs. That affects everything from the reader base you build, the margins you expect, even the content you produce.

The problem is when the real costs of doing business show up, which they inevitably will, your little business may no longer be viable because it was built on false cost model.

Amazon have a strategy to control publishing, which is why weve had the apparently generous KU, ACX and CreateSpace pricing and payment models. However, theyre now calling in the debt they incurred setting up their control over publishing, which means well be expected to pay the real costs one way or another. In the case of KU thats an ever reducing payment through rates, KENP and redefining a page read. In the case of ACX, prices went up and now sales are down by up to 90%. CreateSpace will be the next cost to be adjusted.

Im fine with Amazon correcting the costs of doing business, but theyre no longer competitive, so Ill pick the suppliers I like best. Due to Amazons lack of transparency, outright misleading behavior, one sided TOS, and bully-boy tactics, I will never willingly choose Amazon over another equal supplier.

Offline Laran Mithras

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #62 on: October 13, 2017, 04:14:48 AM »
Due to Amazons lack of transparency, outright misleading behavior, one sided TOS, and bully-boy tactics, I will never willingly choose Amazon over another equal supplier.

The best thing any indie could do.
 

Offline Bards and Sages (Julie)

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #63 on: October 13, 2017, 06:02:00 AM »
This...sucks..

I was an ebook seller through mobipocket.com before Amazon absorbed it into KDP. I made a lot of money with Mobipocket though wholesale distribution. They did the SAME THING then. We got like two weeks notice but promised us a "smooth transition" and that they would port all of our titles automatically to Amazon.

My ebooks were unavailable for sale on Amazon for WEEKS. I lost all of the revenue from the other third-party retailers that used Mobipocket to get their books. I actually lost money on KDP because even though you get 70%, you lose money on discounts. When my ebooks were in mobipocket, they were distributed under wholesale deals so when retailers placed my stuff on sale, I make the same money.

This...sucks...

And, of course, this drops on Friday the 13th.

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Offline Mark Gardner

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #64 on: October 13, 2017, 07:02:14 AM »
Never fear Julie, Createspace customer service will write down your complaint from beginning to end. They'll cross all the "T," and dot all the "I." They'll make record of everything you say from "A" to "Z." At the next meeting of all the tier-2 customer service reps, they'll bring your concerns to the group. Nothing will actually happen. But your plight will be made known to the Tier-2 CS reps.

I thought of another way that Amazon is kicking me in the sack over this: I now have no way for my collaborators to purchase at cost a copy of one of the books that they collaborated on. Now, I'm gonna have to charge them and drop ship. Of course since all my business dealings are above board, I'll have to charge them an estimated transaction privilege tax. The eStore discount codes and wholesale model is important enough for me that I'd be willing to pay a yearly subscription, or a per-title fee to keep the eStore. But Amazon does't care what authors want or need. They care about saving another 30 cents or whatever they'll save by eliminating the eStore. I remember when Amazon touted themselves as the champion of the indie author. Their actions in the last few years contradicts this...

Please re-tweet my tweet calling out Jeff Bezos and Amazon: https://twitter.com/Article_94/status/918592060780716032


This...sucks..

I was an ebook seller through mobipocket.com before Amazon absorbed it into KDP. I made a lot of money with Mobipocket though wholesale distribution. They did the SAME THING then. We got like two weeks notice but promised us a "smooth transition" and that they would port all of our titles automatically to Amazon.

My ebooks were unavailable for sale on Amazon for WEEKS. I lost all of the revenue from the other third-party retailers that used Mobipocket to get their books. I actually lost money on KDP because even though you get 70%, you lose money on discounts. When my ebooks were in mobipocket, they were distributed under wholesale deals so when retailers placed my stuff on sale, I make the same money.

This...sucks...

And, of course, this drops on Friday the 13th.

Offline Bards and Sages (Julie)

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #65 on: October 13, 2017, 07:15:07 AM »
I thought of another way that Amazon is kicking me in the sack over this: I now have no way for my collaborators to purchase at cost a copy of one of the books that they collaborated on.

This is a problem for me, too. All of my contributors currently use CS to buy copies at cost or discount rates. I also have some hobby shops that buy my book using discount codes. Now I have to process those as sales myself. For contributors, it becomes a matter of more paperwork for me. OK. That I can handle. But for the hobby shops, now I have to go through the entire process of having them send me their tax resale certs and filing more tax forms with the state of New Jersey.

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Offline Lee Sutherland

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #66 on: October 13, 2017, 07:17:35 AM »
Can someone tell me where the best place to order author copies is?  All of my books except for my new release have been kdp print and I've never had the option to order author copies.

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Offline Lee Sutherland

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #67 on: October 13, 2017, 07:27:26 AM »
To the right on your bookshelf it's in the options under the three dots- at least for my nonfiction it is. I don't have anything else live, but I published the nf last fall before I had even heard of creatspace and was planning to use kdp anyway. Author copies at cost are a nice addition.

Interesting.  It must only be available for certain users at the moment.  I'm going to email them and see if they can add me to it.

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #68 on: October 13, 2017, 07:44:16 AM »
I haven't even gotten any notice from Createspace about this. Is it going out in email batches?

Offline Mark Gardner

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #69 on: October 13, 2017, 07:52:36 AM »
I haven't even gotten any notice from Createspace about this. Is it going out in email batches?

Here's the link to the announcement: https://www.createspace.com/Help/Index.jsp?orgId=00D300000001Sh9&id=50139000000oxUN

In mine, they only listed about 8 books out of all of mine:


I can only assume that they don't consider any of my other titles that haven't sold any units this month via the eStore as "impacted:"

Offline Tonya Snow-Cook

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #70 on: October 13, 2017, 08:02:53 AM »
Lora, I hadn't heard about that! I followed their directions on how to do it, and it hasn't been rolled out to my KDP account yet. I'm really looking forward to it.

Same here. No option for this yet, but I just sent KDP Support an email inquiring about this option and asked if it's only rolled out to certain people initially or is it just a glitch in the system. I also included the link to that article in the email. We'll see what they say.
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Offline Bill Hiatt

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #71 on: October 13, 2017, 08:09:39 AM »
I was skeptical when Amazon said they were eventually going to make proof and author copies available through KDP Print. Well, now they have. They also said months ago that expanded distribution would eventually be part of the package. At the risk of sounding overly optimistic, we can't be sure at this point that expanded distribution won't be part of the eventual package.

As far as Amazon's possible desire to be a monopoly, CS is already part of Amazon.  In that respect, all Amazon is doing is shifting business from one pocket to another. I don't see how that gives them a larger hold on the print business than they already had. What it does do, assuming Amazon wants to be dominant, is give Amazon an incentive to stay competitive with other options. If Ingram-Spark does indeed start raining coupon codes, my bet is KDP Print will develop coupon codes.

Yes, Amazon has shown it isn't any more trustworthy than any other large corporation. It will do what it perceives will increase power and profit. However, in POD distribution, it's not the only game in town, and never will be. (I don't see Ingram-Spark going out of business, no matter what Amazon does.) The only thing keeping authors with CS is that it had the necessary features and the lowest production costs. If Kindle Print doesn't maintain that position by the time CS shuts down, authors will flock to alternatives.

As far as the KU comparison is concerned, I don't think it's entirely accurate. Authors can conceivably lose something by leaving KU. Not everyone does as well wide as they do from KU (even now--though that may not always be true). What do authors lose by having paperbacks printed by Ingram-Spark if Amazon isn't providing what they need? Absolutely nothing.

Of course, what may happen in the future doesn't help people like Mark and Julie right now. As a community of authors, we should keep nagging Amazon to add the necessary features to KDP Print.


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Offline Bill Hiatt

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #72 on: October 13, 2017, 08:13:40 AM »
Speaking of working as an author community, retweet Mark's tweet. It only takes a minutes.


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Offline Tonya Snow-Cook

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #73 on: October 13, 2017, 08:31:00 AM »
Okay, so I just got a quick reply from KDP Support regarding the Author Copies feature. As I suspected, it's only rolled out to limited publishers for now. Here's the reply:


Hello,

Thanks for contacting Amazon KDP. I hope this email finds you well.

Thanks for your interest in author copies. Author copies are a beta feature we are testing with selected publishers. We're working to make it more widely available.

You will need to order your book on Amazon.com at the retail price.

I hope this information helps.

Thanks for using Amazon KDP. Have a lovely weekend.
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Offline AnnetteL

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Re: Createspace closing its store? And so it begins...
« Reply #74 on: October 13, 2017, 08:32:21 AM »
Well, crap. I've been away from KB for a spell, and I come back to learn this. (Good thing I did!)

RT-ed Mark's tweet!