Author Topic: Warning About Returning Kindles  (Read 1577 times)  

Offline GirlFriday

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Warning About Returning Kindles
« on: November 11, 2017, 12:17:22 AM »
I know a lot of you have returned multiple Kindles until you got one you felt was satisfactory,  so I thought I'd throw this out there. When I ordered my Oasis16, the first one had a defective charging cover. Contacted Amazon and they exchanged it, no problem. The replacement sadly was also defective so I exchanged it again. Fortunately the third one was perfect.

A few weeks after I got the third one I got an email from Amazon warning me about my "excessive returns" and that my account could be suspended if it continued. Mind you, the Kindle is literally the the ONLY thing I've ever returned/exchanged in my many many years with Amazon. I responded to the email, explained why I had returned the first two, and haven't heard anything since. My account is in good standing. I thought I'd let you guys know though, as it seems Amazon isn't being so generous with exchanges/returns anymore.
Proud owner of a Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro, and Phone X

Offline Ann in Arlington

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Re: Warning About Returning Kindles
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2017, 05:35:09 AM »
People have gotten such emails before. I think Amazon hasn't changed their policy, but what they DON'T want is people ordering and returning things and essentially using their store as a cheap alternative to 'Rent-a-Center'.

I suspect that the email you got was generated without benefit of human input. So an algorithm noted you'd returned 2 expensive things, one right after the other, and, in both cases, very soon after ordering. The algorithm didn't look any further to see why, it just sent the email as a reminder/warning. It couldn't distinguish between two defective items returned and a case of someone, say, buying a TV and a fancy grill and returning both at the end of a weekend.


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AquaKindle
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Offline ellenoc

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Re: Warning About Returning Kindles
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2017, 01:20:16 PM »
If you contact Amazon and say, "The Oasis I received is defective," and then return it and get a new one, isn't that different from a straight return? I'd think it would be.

Offline Ann in Arlington

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Re: Warning About Returning Kindles
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2017, 02:46:33 PM »
If you contact Amazon and say, "The Oasis I received is defective," and then return it and get a new one, isn't that different from a straight return? I'd think it would be.

Yes . . . but.

If you just don't like it, they'll charge return shipping. If it is defective, they'll not charge that and send the replacement out even before the first one comes back.

And the but: they are being a bit more discerning as to what 'defective' means. I suspect that they had a lot of returns when they first started with the lights because of people seeing 'blotches' and 'scalloping' and 'gradients' simply because their eyes were more sensitive to such things. I would guess they got a lot of those back and determined there was no 'defect' but simply a variation that was within standards, even if it wasn't acceptable to the customer.

Of course, that sort of thing is not something they can troubleshoot over the phone, but I suspect they also had a lot of 'not really defective' units returned. As a result, if you ask for a refund vs a replacement, they're going to want to be sure it's really defective. And, even if you want a replacement, they want to make sure that it's not just a glitch or user error because there is a cost to them to accept the return and send a replacement.

They do want the customer to be happy -- but they don't want to be paying return shipping for people who just don't like it.

My Kindles
Nautilus (Voyage)
Oasis 2016
AquaKindle
Godric's Hollow (Basic)
S7Edge (KApp for Android)
Galaxy (KApp for Android)
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Offline Atunah

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Re: Warning About Returning Kindles
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2017, 03:03:04 PM »
Ann, I do agree that they are watching those that just don't like something, like the screens or some things. I know I have seen some postings of some that want and have returned the new Oasis only because they forgot to turn of wifi and it updated to the new software and they want to jail break it. I find that ridiculous.

But, GirlFriday doesn't fit that pattern at all. The first Oasis was not usable, unless the cover worked. And when it is such a manufacture fault, a customer after just 2 of such replacements should not really get that email.

I have had one replacement of the new Oasis and I had 2 of the K3 and one of the K1. The K3, I has issues with one that the bezel separated from the screen, like it wasn't glued down and the other had a half an inch open gap on the back I can't explain how that one ever got send out. I could see the innards on that one. The K1 was a refurb to begin with and the large button kept getting stuck. I have had the Voyage and first Oasis with no issue, so the Oasis2 is the first replacement since the K3, which was I think bought in 2010. I have had replacements of only 2 other items since, a scale and something else I can't recall now, small item.
But technically, I should have gotten such email too, if we go by returns like GirlFriday. But my husband is linked to my prime and he orders a lot of stuff for his work. I mean lots of stuff, some stuff in the 1000's so maybe they are going not just by items, but by price overall?

I really think they should not count things that are not in working condition, or have some manufacture defect.
But there are other folks out there that keep getting kindle after kindle, when nothing is wrong with them really and they'll never like the lighted screens on them. They should all then also get such an email though.

I would totally worry getting such an email. What if you want a new kindle and something is really wrong with it. So they suspend the account? Then what. You lose all your content? Can't ever buy any more books to read? Or buy movies or anything else on Amazon?

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Offline northofdivision

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Re: Warning About Returning Kindles
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2017, 10:34:44 PM »
I know a lot of you have returned multiple Kindles until you got one you felt was satisfactory,  so I thought I'd throw this out there. When I ordered my Oasis16, the first one had a defective charging cover. Contacted Amazon and they exchanged it, no problem. The replacement sadly was also defective so I exchanged it again. Fortunately the third one was perfect.

A few weeks after I got the third one I got an email from Amazon warning me about my "excessive returns" and that my account could be suspended if it continued. Mind you, the Kindle is literally the the ONLY thing I've ever returned/exchanged in my many many years with Amazon. I responded to the email, explained why I had returned the first two, and haven't heard anything since. My account is in good standing. I thought I'd let you guys know though, as it seems Amazon isn't being so generous with exchanges/returns anymore.

I'm sorry you got the email. I imagine it could be a little startling. I will say though that if you're returning hardware that had a charging problem, that is legitimate and they shouldn't be sending notices like that your way. Many of us spend thousands of dollars at Amazon so when your hardware is broken that's really frustrating. All the subjective lighting problems that people have regarding gradient, shading, brightness, splotching, is surely tricky for them but their job is to take care of their customers. I would think it's rare a single person wants to tend to the hassle of returning a Kindle to pull a fast one on Amazon other than genuinely being unhappy with their product. I'm sure there re a lot of little return hustles for products on Amazon but I really think the vast majority of Kindle readers just want to be happy with their reader if/when they return devices multiple times. 
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Offline northofdivision

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Re: Warning About Returning Kindles
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2017, 11:03:36 PM »

I really think they should not count things that are not in working condition, or have some manufacture defect.
But there are other folks out there that keep getting kindle after kindle, when nothing is wrong with them really and they'll never like the lighted screens on them. They should all then also get such an email though.


I would argue that for many of the people who see lighting flaws, they would definitely see their Kindle as having something wrong with it and think they have every right to return it to get a replacement. We're talking about a company that makes billions of dollars. I will completely agree, however, that if you are catching lighting problems on 1 or 2 Kindles, you might just want to spare yourself the 8 returns because you're almost certainly going to see the same lighting problem on the 1st and the 8th (Kindle Voyage for me).
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Offline Atunah

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Re: Warning About Returning Kindles
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2017, 06:39:37 AM »
I would argue that for many of the people who see lighting flaws, they would definitely see their Kindle as having something wrong with it and think they have every right to return it to get a replacement. We're talking about a company that makes billions of dollars. I will completely agree, however, that if you are catching lighting problems on 1 or 2 Kindles, you might just want to spare yourself the 8 returns because you're almost certainly going to see the same lighting problem on the 1st and the 8th (Kindle Voyage for me).

Yeah, I was talking about those that would exchange like 8 or 10 kindles to try to find a perfect screen. We all know there can be some issues, I had one of the O2 with one after all, not a "color" issue per se, but a dot on the screen. And to be fair, that one did have a more noticable gradient than the replacement, but I wouldn't have exchanged it for that.
And absolutely one has the right to get one that is as good to read on as possible. And in working condition of course, which is what GirlFriday's were not.
But when I see some over the years keep getting 6, 8 and more of them and they still keep going to get that perfection, I assume that some of their late reluctance to exchange stems from that. Not so much this forum, but others.

I barely had enough nerve to get the one exchange, I have no clue how those folks get so many of them over and over.  :-X

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Offline FearIndex

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Re: Warning About Returning Kindles
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2017, 06:43:12 AM »
Unfortunate to hear. Perhaps they have become more stringent about accepting returns.

Personally I have exchanged I think two Kindles over screens (or something like that) as well as returned a couple due to screens. I haven't had any other issues that I can recall and I've bought a couple of dozen of Kindles... I have luckily never gotten any emails. The screen issues were poorer than usual contrast, light quality and/or pinholes. Funnily enough the one Kindle I did not exchange is the worst, my first Paperwhite, which I deemed a hopeless product and that a replacement would not be likely materially better. I kept it as a memento.

What IS difficult about this is that beyond some generic assumptions that are pretty safe IMO (Paperwhite 1 is always bad, Voyage always has a top-down gradient, Oasis always has a left-right gradient), there are legitimate unit-to-unit differences in e-ink screen contrast (lightness of background, blackess of text, boldness of text) and especially frontlight evenness differences (e.g. LEDs with different qualities, layer alignment issues, pinholes/specks due to dirt or damage).

And the unit-to-unit differences are the part where really only exchanging helps - and it genuinely can help, though it can also make things worse - since there isn't (for most of us anyway) a store where we could walk in and evaluate a unit before purchase. Really, what would help most is Amazon as well as their e-ink provider also, getting the quality more uniform.

These emails, while I agree probably automated and not soo smart, will certainly give me a pause in ordering Kindles in the future. The ability to exchange them without too many questions asked has made the above differences bearable.

Offline ellenoc

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Re: Warning About Returning Kindles
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2017, 02:45:42 PM »
What I saw that struck me as over the top were posts saying someone was ordering several colors/models of something (covers come to mind) and planning to keep their favorite and return the others. Stuff like that is bound to make a company tighten its return policies.

So far I've had good luck. I did return two KKs over the constant spontaneous rebooting problem before posts here and in other forums made it pretty clear that the problem was with the Amazon cover that attached with metal hooks that went into the body of the device. I never used the cover on the 3d one I got and it never had a problem. I suspect I returned 2 perfectly good devices, but then Amazon shares some of the blame. They never did admit those covers were a problem.

I also returned one Voyage, not when I first got it but under warranty later during its first year. The 3G modem stopped working, and I actually had a hard time getting them to replace it. A service rep would make me jump through bunches of hoops, the thing would work once, and they'd declare it fixed, and of course it would stop working again within a day. I had to get "forceful." The replacement for it was refurbished and never had a problem. In fact I got the full $65 trade in (plus $20 extra offer) when I traded it to alleviate cost of the O2).

Offline kindlecollector

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Re: Warning About Returning Kindles
« Reply #10 on: November 13, 2017, 05:33:28 PM »
I have one or more of every Kindle model except the Oasis 1 and the Paperwhite sixth generation.  I rarely need the light on those which have it as I rarely read in bed.  Also I have the old illuminated cases for the K3, K4/K5 and KT models and the internal LED lighting on the PW and later lighted screen models is so much better than the swing out or pull out light arms provided that there is no comparison.  I have no complaints at all regarding the lighting on the PW1, PW3, Voyage or Oasis 2.  It does the intended job and my 73 year old eyes find it satisfactory for reading in all cases.  As has been pointed out Amazon has added more LEDs with each new model, apparently in an attempt to make the pickiest customers happy.  So now there are complaints about battery life,  very likely due to the number of LEDs being powered.  No satisfying some people.