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Question for Romance Writers.

12K views 201 replies 39 participants last post by  WegR 
#1 ·
So, I've been wondering this for awhile now and I realize it has the potential to turn into a very heated debate, but... my curiosity burns.


How many of you romance writers include "people of color" (black, asian, african, hispanic etc) as heroes or heroines in your stories?

If you do, how many books out of your current collection feature POCs?

Is the POC usually the hero (top) or heroine (bottom)? Or split down the middle?

If you do not or have not, why is that?
 
#2 ·
BlossomBubblesButtercup said:
I'm not a romance writer yet. I'm currently finishing up a series in another genre before I delve into romance. BUT when I do begin my romance writing all my main characters will be POC. All mains in every book I write will be POC.
Nice. That's actually sort of what I do. I always include one POC. Sometimes they both end up being POC, really depends on the story. But there's always one.
 
#4 ·
One of the main characters and his wife in Seattle Quake 9.2 are black. I write mostly Scottish historical novels, before the time before British slavery, but I've got plenty of Vikings, if they count. One of my mysteries has an American Indian, and some of my Triplet Trilogy takes place on an Arizona Indian Reservation. I'm not opposed to writing about other ethnic groups, but I fear taking the chance of offending someone, and getting a novel trashed because of it. There is that, you know.
 
#5 ·
Martitalbott said:
I'm not opposed to writing about other ethnic groups, but I fear taking the chance of offending someone, and getting a novel trashed because of it. There is that, you know.
I was waiting for someone to say this. People would trash a novel with a POC main? Because they're written badly?

I don't count Vikings as POC just because they're Scandinavian which is in Europe and POC generally refers to people not of European descent. I know, it's really not the best phrasing, but hey it's what we've got.
 
#6 ·
There was a pretty good (and pretty long) thread about it quite a while back. Don't remember the name of the topic though.

It was around when I was just get started writing, and some of the issues that came up convincing me to *not* include any characters presented as POC - and generally to avoid any explicit mention of race as much as possible.

Main concerns, for me, were appealing to the broadest possible Romance audience and avoiding drawing potential ire from readers who might take offence at some aspect of how a POC was portrayed or not portrayed.
 
#8 ·
boba1823 said:
There was a pretty good (and pretty long) thread about it quite a while back. Don't remember the name of the topic though.

It was around when I was just get started writing, and some of the issues that came up convincing me to *not* include any characters presented as POC - and generally to avoid any explicit mention of race as much as possible.

Main concerns, for me, were appealing to the broadest possible Romance audience and avoiding drawing potential ire from readers who might take offence at some aspect of how a POC was portrayed or not portrayed.
I think I missed that thread, sadly. I feel like any way you write something, you risk someone being upset about how a character is or isn't portrayed. Re: the thread about heroines, ha!

I've been sorta warring with writing what I want versus writing to the broadest possible audience. I decided I was going to write what I'd read. And I prefer to read stuff with POCs as at least one of the mains.
 
#9 ·
This is an especially interesting topic to me because I have a 3 book series coming out in the next couple of months set in San Antonio, Texas. All the heroes are Hispanic and from the um, less affluent side of town, though now are middle class. All the heroines are Anglo. I'm writing what I know. In most of my other stories, however, I usually have at least one Hispanic as a side character because where I come from, that's the way life is. Texas is pretty much a polyglot at all levels of society. I don't write other POC (and have to say, that's the first time I've encountered the term for U.S. minorities) because I don't know the cultures as well. I would not want to inadvertently offend or make a major gaffe.
 
#10 ·
idontknowyet said:
There are very few people in this day and age in the US that aren't POC regardless of the shade of their skin. The US is a melting pot. That's what all those DNA tests have been showing people. I'm writing about people who live in the US.
Sure....

I said POC because it's an easy identifier without going: How often do you include someone who has darker skin tone shades or differs from the norm, say speaks a language other than English in the home, has recently migrated to whatever place your work is set in, or self-identifies as a person of color (because we can say everyone's POC, but not everyone identifies as POC).
 
#11 ·
dj Rangel said:
This is an especially interesting topic to me because I have a 3 book series coming out in the next couple of months set in San Antonio, Texas. All the heroes are Hispanic and from the um, less affluent side of town, though now are middle class. All the heroines are Anglo. I'm writing what I know. In most of my other stories, however, I usually have at least one Hispanic as a side character because where I come from, that's the way life is. Texas is pretty much a polyglot at all levels of society. I don't write other POC (and have to say, that's the first time I've encountered the term for U.S. minorities) because I don't know the cultures as well. I would not want to inadvertently offend or make a major gaffe.
Nice! Yeah, I've lived in TX. You're right.

I feel like "POC" is the most generic word to use considering in some places the "minority" isn't the minority, like Texas. Pretty sure there are a lot more people of majority Hispanic descent than of majority European descent. It's not the best term. But neither is minority, neither is "colored", and I didn't want to try to list every different type of person, say it wrong, offend someone, etc etc. So.. POC.
 
#12 ·
i agree on using the word minority. Even as I typed it in my original post I was thinking, 'I don't like that word.' :) But then, I don't like POC, either, but I haven't a clue as to what other designation to use. Even using the term Hispanic can offend some - or terms like Latino, Chicano, Mexican-American. Whatever someone chooses to be sensitive about, I suppose.
 
#13 ·
Most people don't live in a bubble. (Maybe some Mormon or Amish etc groups) As authors we create story from a combination of imagination and experience. Are peoples ethnicities really any issue anymore? Maybe if the author is playing up stereotypes instead of as individuals.
 
#14 ·
dj Rangel said:
i agree on using the word minority. Even as I typed it in my original post I was thinking, 'I don't like that word.' :) But then, I don't like POC, either, but I haven't a clue as to what other designation to use. Even using the term Hispanic can offend some - or terms like Latino, Chicano, Mexican-American. Whatever someone chooses to be sensitive about, I suppose.
Yep. For example, I don't like using the world "African-American" for American Black people.

idontknowyet said:
Most people don't live in a bubble. (Maybe some Mormon or Amish etc groups) As authors we create story from a combination of imagination and experience. Are peoples ethnicities really any issue anymore? Maybe if the author is playing up stereotypes instead of as individuals.
I feel like I can't comment on this without it toeing the line.

So, I'm guessing you include a variety of different ethnic backgrounds in your work as main characters? In particular as the hero and/or heroine?
 
#15 ·
L_Loryn said:
Yep. For example, I don't like using the world "African-American" for American Black people.

I feel like I can't comment on this without it toeing the line.

So, I'm guessing you include a variety of different ethnic backgrounds in your work as main characters? In particular as the hero and/or heroine?
I didn't really do a break down. I'm just starting to write, but yeah I'm just including people. I didn't really think oh I need to have an person with ____ color skin here. It should happen naturally.
 
#16 ·
idontknowyet said:
I didn't really do a break down. I'm just starting to write, but yeah I'm just including people. I didn't really think oh I need to have an person with ____ color skin here. It should happen naturally.
It should, exactly. No one's saying you have to put token POC in anything, I was just asking if you did or didn't.

I always think about who my characters are when I write, what they identify as, and no one just thinks of his or herself as a "person". There's identities -- with sexuality, with ethnicity, with anything. So I tend to know if my character identifies as a POC or not. I also know if they're gay, straight, bisexual, pansexual, asexual, etc. I know their religion, how they feel about organic food, if they like pets, what car they drive and why.

That's where the question comes from, I assume most people do a similar method of character development as I do. If not, that's cool.
 
#17 ·
boba1823 said:
There was a pretty good (and pretty long) thread about it quite a while back. Don't remember the name of the topic though.

It was around when I was just get started writing, and some of the issues that came up convincing me to *not* include any characters presented as POC - and generally to avoid any explicit mention of race as much as possible.

Main concerns, for me, were appealing to the broadest possible Romance audience and avoiding drawing potential ire from readers who might take offence at some aspect of how a POC was portrayed or not portrayed.
Unfortunately, I've recently seen authors report that books with black men on the cover have performed worse than books with white men on the cover. The sad truth is that books that are branded as having PoC as MCs don't usually do as well in romance.

I'm finally publishing my first non-white heroine. It was a huge PITA finding a photo with a female model who looked Asian. That's definitely an issue, somewhat mitigated by the choice to use solo dudes on a cover. But the availability of images with interracial couples is definitely an issue in putting out more diverse books.
 
#18 ·
Crystal_ said:
Unfortunately, I've recently seen authors report that books with black men on the cover have performed worse than books with white men on the cover. The sad truth is that books that are branded as having PoC as MCs don't usually do as well in romance.

I'm finally publishing my first non-white heroine. It was a huge PITA finding a photo with a female model who looked Asian. That's definitely an issue, somewhat mitigated by the choice to use solo dudes on a cover. But the availability of images with interracial couples is definitely an issue in putting out more diverse books.
I always find the "melted pot" type of person for my covers. Dark hair, usually, dark eyes, usually, tanned. Works enough.
 
#19 ·
All the romances I've written so far include POC main characters.  I didn't plan it that way, it just sort of happened, due to the nature of the stories I want to tell. 

My science fiction romance features a millennia old, worldwide secret society, so of course its leaders are going to come from all over.  Of the books written so far:
1. He's black, she's white, both Americans
2. He's white, she's Hispanic (Californian, about 3-4 generations from Mexican immigrants), both American
3. M/M, they're both Iranian
Prequel. He's Russian Jewish, she's Japanese

Still n the planning stages:
4. She's African (Cameroonian), he's Spanish (from Spain)
5. He's Greek, she's Chinese (I think from Hong Kong, although that may change.  Maybe mixed race, not sure yet.)
6. She's Brazilian, he's Korean (and a paraplegic)
7. She's Indian, pretty sure it's going to be a F/M/F menage, not sure of the other two's race/nationality yet

My other series is contemporary, and stemmed from an idea that required my first FMC to be an undocumented immigrant from Mexico.  Her MMC is white.  The second is about her sister, who's an American citizen (born here) of undocumented parents.  Her MMC is Tejano/White.  I make a comment in the book that the Hispanic side of his family, who were Texans when Texas joined the US in 1845, have been American citizens longer than his Anglo side, who were German and Czech immigrants in the later half of the 1800's.  I've set up his three cousins to be MMC's of future books.  They're Hispanic on both sides.  Who knows who their FMC's will be.
 
#20 ·
Although I write mostly erotica it has a lot of romance built into it. I have several joint main characters, as couples, who include an Hispanic person and there is at least one who is multiracial.

I can't write African American people well because honestly, I don't know the use of language well enough to make it look honest. With the US's long history of caricatures in entertainment that's the last thing I want to do, is come off like a white guy trying to write something that 'looks black'. Of course, not all African Americans use ebonics, but at the same time enough of them do, and if you are portraying an African American character you want it to appear genuine.

With the multiracial character, it was a bit easier, especially as I have met a few more of them, and had more to draw from in creating the character to make him appear genuine, as a real person.

One last thing, in erotica there can be a tendency with the nature of the stories to make the characters appear unidimensional. Some of it is just the nature of the form of entertainment. I go out of my way to avoid that, especially when dealing with POC's, because -- once again -- US history is full of such people being portrayed as caricatures. If I can't make the person a real person, I won't go there.
 
#21 ·
I've read plenty of romances with POC characters that lacked any cultural flavor. So much so that I forgot they were supposed to be POC. They were basically coffee colored white people. It's probably so readers can project their ideal hero/heroine into the story without many identifiers that would zap them out of the moment.

Personally, I enjoy reading about the cultural specific things that go with a POC.
 
#22 ·
If you put this into a search box (not this site's), it should bring up several threads along the lines of your question:

people of color as characters kboards

I don't write romance, but my stories often have POC (which is the currently accepted term for people who are not Caucasian -- I'm a member of a group on FB that is mostly AA, and that's the term they use, so I know it's okay). I don't set out to do it, but my muse sends me what he sends me.

It may be harder to sell books with a non-white person on the cover, and it may not be a huge audience, but I see lots of readers who are eager to find books that are about people like them, both in skin color and experience. If you want to hit the biggest audience, at this point you may be better off not having a POC as the main character, but there is a reader out there for other books. It's just a matter of finding them. Give them characters they can relate to, not just differently-colored white people, try to target them in ads, and they will want to read your books.
 
#23 ·
jb1111 said:
I can't write African American people well because honestly, I don't know the use of language well enough to make it look honest. With the US's long history of caricatures in entertainment that's the last thing I want to do, is come off like a white guy trying to write something that 'looks black'. Of course, not all African Americans use ebonics, but at the same time enough of them do, and if you are portraying an African American character you want it to appear genuine.
Interesting. I don't write my Black characters in using ebonics automatically. It depends on their background and who they're with which is because I don't use ebonics unless I'm around certain people (family, Black friends). If I'm in mixed company I stick to proper English. Most of my Black characters end up the same way.

C. Gold said:
I've read plenty of romances with POC characters that lacked any cultural flavor. So much so that I forgot they were supposed to be POC. They were basically coffee colored white people. It's probably so readers can project their ideal hero/heroine into the story without many identifiers that would zap them out of the moment.

Personally, I enjoy reading about the cultural specific things that go with a POC.
I have came across this, too. There's a delicate balance between the POC being a caricature and being real, like Asians being intelligent nerds or Black people wearing stylish kicks, sagging their pants, and packing heat.

What I generally do is I start with the main MC and have him deal with some pesky cultural problems along with whatever he's doing otherwise. My last story in particular was about a Romani bisexual man raising a child. Instead of making him the "typical" Romani man, I used his mother, father, sister, ex-girlfriend to explore the facets of his culture without him having to sing and dance for the crowd.

Other times, say, if I'm writing a billionaire romance. My billionaire can be a rich Black man who's not famous from playing sports, but grandma (or great grandma) uses ebonics as a nod to the fact that it's there, but moving around in the world as a successful Black person, sometimes you really kind of present as a "coffee colored" white person.

she-la-ti-da said:
I don't write romance, but my stories often have POC (which is the currently accepted term for people who are not Caucasian -- I'm a member of a group on FB that is mostly AA, and that's the term they use, so I know it's okay). I don't set out to do it, but my muse sends me what he sends me.

It may be harder to sell books with a non-white person on the cover, and it may not be a huge audience, but I see lots of readers who are eager to find books that are about people like them, both in skin color and experience. If you want to hit the biggest audience, at this point you may be better off not having a POC as the main character, but there is a reader out there for other books. It's just a matter of finding them. Give them characters they can relate to, not just differently-colored white people, try to target them in ads, and they will want to read your books.
Yeah, I'm not really concerned with hitting the biggest audience. I've done business for a long time (not writing in particular, but other forms of business) and I've found you can do two things: go for what you know sells and move on or do something unique and hope for the best. I tend to do the latter.

So, in some ways, I write for myself. I've seen the books featuring Black people and if they're written by Black people, they'll portray a lifestyle I'm not into. As in, black woman finds cheating POS boyfriend and wants to go beat up the ex-girlfriend. Everyone's flashy and there's a big messy fight, which isn't my life or how I was raised (ebonics or not). Or they're written by white people as the fetish or the story puts a major focus on the Black person being Black as the majority of the attraction.

Since I was a child, I've wanted to read gay romance featuring POC in a way white people get to read about each other in romance. As in, the POC gets more than being the Black guy from the other side of the tracks or the nerdy Asian or the Hispanic person with a bad temper who speaks half English-half Spanish all the time. I wanted to pick up a book that didn't make the POC the major selling point and go on to read it, just like white people don't go: "Aiden Blake Edwards was a white guy from the trailer park and Joey Aaron Smith was a rich, white billionaire".

Like I said before, I keep my covers pretty racially ambiguous and I don't even mention my character's race in the blurb. If someone gets upset halfway through the book because my second MC is Hispanic, well that's really personal. I don't target people looking for multicultural romance in my ad spends because, what do you know, I don't type in "mm BLACK romance" when I go searching for a book.

Yeah, that got long.
 
#26 ·
I don't ever think in terms of POC, and frankly referring to people as coloured or a person of colour is considered racist here in Australia. In my novels, my characters, and couples are typical of Australia's multi-cultural diversity. I don't consider the ratio of male to female skin colour variation is relevant in life or to relationships. Differences in personality and culture do have a relevance to how people connect, but those differences are not tied to the amount of melanin in the skin.

Reading some of the other comments I see mention of cultural behaviour associated with skin colour. Maybe my experience is totally different to your experience. I don't see skin pigmentation and behaviour or culture as being necessarily connected.

I would just write the story, and mention skin colour only when, and if, and at the time when it's relevant. The best books, in my opinion, focus on the character of people and what is happening to them, and not what they look like. Skin colour isn't an issue in a good story, unless it is a story about racism, rather than a story about life and love.
 
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