Author Topic: Whole book discussion, spoilers for ACOK.  (Read 1218 times)  

Offline jason10mm

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Whole book discussion, spoilers for ACOK.
« on: February 28, 2012, 04:28:30 am »
So, after ACOK the Starks look to be in pretty dire straits (yuk yuk :) as Winterfell is put to the torch, Bran and Rickon are missing, presumed dead, Jon has gone over to the Wildlings, Sansa lost her betrothal to Joffrey, Arya is on the run somewhere in the Trident, Robb is mucking around in western Westeros winning battles but losing the war, and Catelyn is stuck with a dying father and an inexperienced brother. Pretty big reversal from the beginning of the book when it looked like the Lannisters were on the ropes. Stannis opened big but spent all his effort fighting what should have been allies, eventually getting sandwiched between a Tyrion-bolstered King's Landing and the Littlefinger influenced Tyrell host. Where will he go? Back to Dragonstone? The Baratheons look to be all but extinguished at this point. Tyrion has managed to get his niece and nephew out from under Cersei's nose but with the arrival of Tywin all his efforts might be for naught. He looks to be on the outs with his family, with someone actively trying to kill him! Dany, on the other hand, is practically back to square one aside from having the baby dragons. Her confidence level is much higher though.

1. Which character do you like the most? I just LOVE Tyrion, I see a lot of myself in him. It is nice to see that a man can live by his wits in Westeros and still have a code of honor. I think Littlefinger is kind of an anti-Tyrion, a man who also lives by his wits but is much more self-serving and destructive.

2. Do you think the war is now over? Robb is essentially orphaned in the Trident with no home base, a united Lannister/Tyrell army waiting for him, and no other serious contenders for the throne around to ally with. Can he call out the Vale? Join with the Martells? Make peace with the Greyjoys? Seems to me he has little choice but to try to get back to the North and hope the Lannisters don't cut him off at the Neck at the Freys.

3. What is Catelyn going to do with Jamie? This is the real wildcard here, the Starks/Tullys still have one great point of leverage over the Lannisters. Will she use him as bait for a trap, trade him for peace, or kill him out of spite? But what about Sansa?

4. Where do you see Dany going? I don't see how she could amass any great army at this point, she is practically a vagabond road show. I think she is either going to have to ally herself with another man like Drogo or try to take advantage of the confusion in Westeros and hope to bring a house to her side. Maybe the Martells? They were the last house to bend the knee to a Targaryen but they have little love for the Lannisters or Tyrells. Dany might be able to make common cause with them.

5. What is Stannis going to do? He got his ass handed to him, totally and completely. Anything other than hiding out in Dragonstone and playing turtle would shock me. But he does still have Melisandre, will his desperation drive him to use her magic again? Could he swallow the past and make cause with Dany?

6. Jon and the Wildlings. Is he going to forget his vows? What exactly are those guys doing in the mountains? What does it mean for the Night's Watch?


I'm going to take a month or so break, then put up the second Dunk and Egg story, which is the "The Sworn Sword" (I think). Around May we will start with "A Storm of Swords", which will give the GOT show time to get started and we might pick up some new fans!

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    Offline Rin

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    Re: Whole book discussion, spoilers for ACOK.
    « Reply #1 on: March 02, 2012, 02:17:11 pm »
    Quote
    1. Which character do you like the most? I just LOVE Tyrion, I see a lot of myself in him. It is nice to see that a man can live by his wits in Westeros and still have a code of honor. I think Littlefinger is kind of an anti-Tyrion, a man who also lives by his wits but is much more self-serving and destructive.
    Tyrion was my favourite character since the first time he slapped Joffrey in the second episode of the show...I picked up the books so I could read more about him. ^_^

    I was also happy to learn more about Jorah.

    Quote
    2. Do you think the war is now over? Robb is essentially orphaned in the Trident with no home base, a united Lannister/Tyrell army waiting for him, and no other serious contenders for the throne around to ally with. Can he call out the Vale? Join with the Martells? Make peace with the Greyjoys? Seems to me he has little choice but to try to get back to the North and hope the Lannisters don't cut him off at the Neck at the Freys.
    I'm not convinced the Vale will ever do anything (though I'm willing to be proven wrong). And **** the Greyjoys, seriously.

    They need to make another wall at the Neck, and just keep the North for themselves.

    Quote
    3. What is Catelyn going to do with Jamie? This is the real wildcard here, the Starks/Tullys still have one great point of leverage over the Lannisters. Will she use him as bait for a trap, trade him for peace, or kill him out of spite? But what about Sansa?
    I was hoping she'd burn his pretty hair off or something.

    Quote
    4. Where do you see Dany going? I don't see how she could amass any great army at this point, she is practically a vagabond road show. I think she is either going to have to ally herself with another man like Drogo or try to take advantage of the confusion in Westeros and hope to bring a house to her side. Maybe the Martells? They were the last house to bend the knee to a Targaryen but they have little love for the Lannisters or Tyrells. Dany might be able to make common cause with them.
    Chill, and wait for her dragons to grow to king-eating size? Maybe by then, they'll have one king (or one, and one in the North), but I suppose that wouldn't be exciting.

    Quote
    5. What is Stannis going to do? He got his *ss handed to him, totally and completely. Anything other than hiding out in Dragonstone and playing turtle would shock me. But he does still have Melisandre, will his desperation drive him to use her magic again? Could he swallow the past and make cause with Dany?
    I half expect if we open Stannis, we'll find Melisandre operating him like a muppet. :P

    Quote
    6. Jon and the Wildlings. Is he going to forget his vows? What exactly are those guys doing in the mountains? What does it mean for the Night's Watch?
    (Huh, as I'm writing this, I'm listening to Hammerfall, and "Take the Black!" is pumping from my speakers :D :D :D).

    Jon, like Ned, will probably Do What Is Right, but be a bit more grey than black.

    Offline foreverjuly

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    Re: Whole book discussion, spoilers for ACOK.
    « Reply #2 on: March 02, 2012, 04:58:32 pm »
    Yes, Tyrion is amazing, as was Arya. Sansa came up big in this book, and finding out at the end that she'd probably just end up being a whore for Joffrey was a great flourish to end on for her storyline. Altogether they had to pull us through Daenarys's lackluster storyline. Catelyn comes in somewhere in the middle along with Davos.

    lol at Rin about the Greyjoys. The list of people who need their comeuppance grows so long that Arya would never sleep if she had to recite them all.
    « Last Edit: March 03, 2012, 04:16:51 am by foreverjuly »

    Offline Rin

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    Re: Whole book discussion, spoilers for ACOK.
    « Reply #3 on: March 02, 2012, 05:51:25 pm »
    Yes, Tyrion is amazing, as was Arya. Sansa came up big in this book, and finding out at the end that she'd probably just end up being a whore for Joffrey was a great flourish to end on for her storyline. Altogether they had to pull us through Daenarys's lackluster storyline. Catelyn comes in somewhere in the middle along with Davos.

    lol at Rin about the Greyjoys. The lost of people who need their comeuppance grows so long that Arya would never sleep if she had to recite them all.

    Yeah, Dany disappointed me, as this book really was just a holding pattern for her.

    Davos...I'm completely torn about him. On the one hand, I like the character, on the other hand, the choice of him for a perspective character sort of confuses me. He's the only choice that feels a little forced, or bending to narrative convention - we need eyes into the Stannis camp, so here's a character. It's a bit of an inarticulate way of putting it, and I'm not really sure what my problem is, there's just something that irks me.

    *goes back to reading Book #3*

    Offline VondaZ

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    Re: Whole book discussion, spoilers for ACOK.
    « Reply #4 on: March 21, 2012, 02:53:27 pm »
    I know these questions were posted a while ago, but I got the Game of Thrones DVD set and have been distracted by that. It is interesting how quickly I have forgotten the way I had pictured the characters. Now I can only see them as they were played in the series. And my views about some of the characters have changed somewhat - I am not sure if they were portrayed a little differently or if I just didn't pick up on certain cues while reading the books.

    1. Which character do you like the most? I just LOVE Tyrion, I see a lot of myself in him. It is nice to see that a man can live by his wits in Westeros and still have a code of honor. I think Littlefinger is kind of an anti-Tyrion, a man who also lives by his wits but is much more self-serving and destructive.

    Tyrion is my favorite also - by far the most interesting character in the book. I like to root for Jon and Arya, but they are not as interesting and three-dimensional as Tyrion.

    2. Do you think the war is now over? Robb is essentially orphaned in the Trident with no home base, a united Lannister/Tyrell army waiting for him, and no other serious contenders for the throne around to ally with. Can he call out the Vale? Join with the Martells? Make peace with the Greyjoys? Seems to me he has little choice but to try to get back to the North and hope the Lannisters don't cut him off at the Neck at the Freys.

    Robb needs to go back home and rebuild Winterfell and his family. He doesn't have a prayer of winning any war the way things stand now. He needs to regroup. I don't know if he will be left alone to do so, though.

    3. What is Catelyn going to do with Jamie? This is the real wildcard here, the Starks/Tullys still have one great point of leverage over the Lannisters. Will she use him as bait for a trap, trade him for peace, or kill him out of spite? But what about Sansa?

    I sure hope she doesn't kill him out of spite. That is not what I would expect from a Stark/Tully. Her family is in trouble. She needs to use Jamie as leverage to be left alone to pull her family back together. That's kind of boring, so it probably won't happen, but her family is in tatters and her home (by marriage) is destroyed.

    4. Where do you see Dany going? I don't see how she could amass any great army at this point, she is practically a vagabond road show. I think she is either going to have to ally herself with another man like Drogo or try to take advantage of the confusion in Westeros and hope to bring a house to her side. Maybe the Martells? They were the last house to bend the knee to a Targaryen but they have little love for the Lannisters or Tyrells. Dany might be able to make common cause with them.

    I don't know where Dany is going, but if she is now connected to Ser Barristan, I am looking forward to seeing where that relationship is headed.

    5. What is Stannis going to do? He got his *ss handed to him, totally and completely. Anything other than hiding out in Dragonstone and playing turtle would shock me. But he does still have Melisandre, will his desperation drive him to use her magic again? Could he swallow the past and make cause with Dany?

    I never imagined him aligned with Dany, but maybe somehow through the connection of Melisandre and magic it could happen. I kind of assumed he would turn to Melisandre since he had a lot of success with her at his side and none without her. He wanted to show that he could win without her, but he couldn't. I think he wants to win badly enough, he doesn't care how he does it. Of course, his anger has always been directed at his brothers and they are both dead, so maybe the fire in him will go out a bit.

    6. Jon and the Wildlings. Is he going to forget his vows? What exactly are those guys doing in the mountains? What does it mean for the Night's Watch?

    Honestly, no clue. I don't feel at this time he is likely to forget his vows, but I suspect that working undercover with the Wildlings, he will gain a whole new understanding of them and their predicament and there may be a lot more here than we suspect. It also seems that there may be some ties between the Starks and the wildlings that may kind of bond Jon to them in some way.

    Offline Lisa J. Yarde

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    Re: Whole book discussion, spoilers for ACOK.
    « Reply #5 on: June 08, 2012, 08:22:48 am »
    Does the DVD set have any bonuses? I'm considering whether to get it.
     
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    Offline jason10mm

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    Re: Whole book discussion, spoilers for ACOK.
    « Reply #6 on: June 11, 2012, 10:51:43 am »
    The first season has quite a few. Lots of episode commentaries, including the kid actors singing the intro theme :)

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