Author Topic: Cleanest way to go wide  (Read 4096 times)  

Offline Herefortheride

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Cleanest way to go wide
« on: August 23, 2017, 08:30:59 am »
I'm planning on going wide with my book one in a couple weeks when it comes off KU. Not going back in!

Is draft to digital the best way to start out? My worry is taking too much time with ton of vendors.

Any suggestions for someone who is just starting to go wide?  =  )

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    Offline Herefortheride

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #1 on: August 23, 2017, 08:33:36 am »
    Wow! Writer's cafe must have a lot of people viewing. I had 15 views on this after one minute! That's insane.

    Offline MClayton

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #2 on: August 23, 2017, 08:39:35 am »
    In my experience, Draft2Digital is the fastest, most streamlined, easiest, and most helpful to work with. Good luck!

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    Offline Benjamin Douglas

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #3 on: August 23, 2017, 08:43:56 am »
    Tangentially to your question, have a look at this thread:

    https://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,254287.0.html

    Waiting with anticipation for Patty's guide.

    Offline notjohn

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #4 on: August 23, 2017, 09:12:37 am »
    Definitely, Draft2Digital. Well worth the 10 percent off the top.

    The only drawback is that D2D doesn't distribute to Google Play (which earns me about as much as Kobo does, therefore very much worth having). I was lucky enough to have an account with Google Books, the predecessor platform, which I was able to reactivate. But Google is a much more difficult platform to work with, so I wouldn't let that keep you away from D2D.
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    Offline Herefortheride

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #5 on: August 23, 2017, 09:44:06 am »
    Definitely, Draft2Digital. Well worth the 10 percent off the top.

    The only drawback is that D2D doesn't distribute to Google Play (which earns me about as much as Kobo does, therefore very much worth having). I was lucky enough to have an account with Google Books, the predecessor platform, which I was able to reactivate. But Google is a much more difficult platform to work with, so I wouldn't let that keep you away from D2D.

    Thanks for the info!

    I'm hoping to get some bookbubs in the future and it seems they are quite hard to get in fantasy if you are in KU. I also think KU is ripping off authors. Even if people are making a lot of money they are leaving a huge chunk on the table by not being more vocal about the page flip issues, among others like the pie being sliced smaller and smaller.

    Offline PiscaPress

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #6 on: August 23, 2017, 09:46:52 am »
    I've been happy with Pronoun so far.
    very very very small publisher
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    Offline aimeeeasterling

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #7 on: August 23, 2017, 09:50:48 am »
    I definitely recommend going direct with Kobo. Their in-store promotions are a great way to get a boost and they're only available if you go direct.

    Ditto with Nook. It's taken me years to land an in-store promotion with them, but when they listed my permafree it kicked my sales there above $1,000 for the first month ever. Better than I did on Nook when I had the same permafree listed on Bookbub!

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    Offline Chrissy

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #8 on: August 23, 2017, 09:54:07 am »
    I definitely recommend going direct with Kobo. Their in-store promotions are a great way to get a boost and they're only available if you go direct.

    Ditto with Nook. It's taken me years to land an in-store promotion with them, but when they listed my permafree it kicked my sales there above $1,000 for the first month ever. Better than I did on Nook when I had the same permafree listed on Bookbub!

    How did you get the in store promotion with BN/Nook Press?

    Offline Herefortheride

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #9 on: August 23, 2017, 10:20:21 am »
    How did you get the in store promotion with BN/Nook Press?

    So Nook and Kobo should be direct? Then is Draft to Digital just for the other vendors?

    Offline MClayton

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #10 on: August 23, 2017, 10:22:33 am »
    I definitely recommend going direct with Kobo. Their in-store promotions are a great way to get a boost and they're only available if you go direct.

    Are the in-store promotions now available to everyone? Back when I went direct with Kobo the promotions were in beta, and only available to a few. It stayed that way for what felt like forever, so I eventually left and began to use D2D for Kobo, as well.

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    Offline AlexaGrave

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #11 on: August 23, 2017, 10:26:13 am »
    Are the in-store promotions now available to everyone? Back when I went direct with Kobo the promotions were in beta, and only available to a few. It stayed that way for what felt like forever, so I eventually left and began to use D2D for Kobo, as well.

    If you contact them and ask for the Promotions tab to be activated, they'll do it within a day or two. I just did this two weeks ago.
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    Offline Mercedes Vox

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #12 on: August 23, 2017, 10:30:57 am »
    So Nook and Kobo should be direct? Then is Draft to Digital just for the other vendors?

    There is no "should be," IMHO. Everyone has different needs, different expectations, and different experiences. You need to do your own due diligence regarding each of the direct services as well as the various aggregators (e.g., Pronoun, D2D, Smashwords, etc.) to see what they can offer you. Read the terms of service for each direct-access retailer and the aggregators first, which will include royalty percentages and payment methods/schedules/minimum thresholds. Read the threads on here regarding each of those services. Then you'll have the information you need to ask more drilled-down questions pertaining to your own particular situation.
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    Offline Seneca42

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #13 on: August 23, 2017, 10:34:26 am »
    I never understood the issue with going direct. I went with D2D only because I'm canadian, so it made sense. But Im direct with kobo and amazon.

    When I update my books or publish a new one, it literally takes me only a couple minutes to upload to kobo. I could be direct with 10 vendors and it's no more hassle than being direct with one in my opinion. Well, okay, instead of a change taking 5 minutes it takes 10 or 15. Of all the time you spend in the publishing process, it's not even a drop in the bucket.

    Giving away 10% of your royalties to save a couple minutes never made sense to me.

    Offline Used To Be BH

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #14 on: August 23, 2017, 10:45:50 am »
    I never understood the issue with going direct. I went with D2D only because I'm canadian, so it made sense. But Im direct with kobo and amazon.

    When I update my books or publish a new one, it literally takes me only a couple minutes to upload to kobo. I could be direct with 10 vendors and it's no more hassle than being direct with one in my opinion. Well, okay, instead of a change taking 5 minutes it takes 10 or 15. Of all the time you spend in the publishing process, it's not even a drop in the bucket.

    Giving away 10% of your royalties to save a couple minutes never made sense to me.
    If you're sure you want to be wide forever, then yes, it probably makes sense to go direct when you can. However, for an author who is experimenting with wide but might change his or her mind, aggregators can get a book taken down much more rapidly sometimes than individuals can. This is particularly an issue with Kobo, who pushes the books way downstream to all kinds of affiliated bookstores. I could be wrong, but I think all the horrors stories I've heard in that regard came from people who went direct to Kobo.

    Sometimes, aggregators are also a shield against individual vendor weirdness. For instance, Pronoun seems to be able to prevent Google Play from doing its arbitrary discounting. Pronoun can also work around some Amazon restrictions (for example, to make books permafree without having to mess with price matching). In both cases, it's probably the Macmillan connection that enables Pronoun to do that.
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    Offline David VanDyke

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #15 on: August 23, 2017, 11:08:58 am »
    It's always a question of cost-benefit how to go wide--aggregator or direct?

    If you're prawny--let's just say under $100 a month in sales--giving aggregators 10% ($10) is likely worth the work savings.

    If you're making much more--let's say $10,000 a month--you have to ask, is it better to give them $1000/month, or do some work to go direct as much as possible and save some or all of that money.

    Offline Herefortheride

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #16 on: August 23, 2017, 11:14:00 am »
    I never understood the issue with going direct. I went with D2D only because I'm canadian, so it made sense. But Im direct with kobo and amazon.

    When I update my books or publish a new one, it literally takes me only a couple minutes to upload to kobo. I could be direct with 10 vendors and it's no more hassle than being direct with one in my opinion. Well, okay, instead of a change taking 5 minutes it takes 10 or 15. Of all the time you spend in the publishing process, it's not even a drop in the bucket.

    Giving away 10% of your royalties to save a couple minutes never made sense to me.

    Perhaps you are looking at it wrong? Many people use D2D and have good things to say about it.

    Offline MClayton

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #17 on: August 23, 2017, 11:46:06 am »
    There is no "should be," IMHO. Everyone has different needs, different expectations, and different experiences. You need to do your own due diligence regarding each of the direct services as well as the various aggregators (e.g., Pronoun, D2D, Smashwords, etc.) to see what they can offer you. Read the terms of service for each direct-access retailer and the aggregators first, which will include royalty percentages and payment methods/schedules/minimum thresholds. Read the threads on here regarding each of those services. Then you'll have the information you need to ask more drilled-down questions pertaining to your own particular situation.

    I agree with this. I've done it all ways - KU, direct to various outlets, wide via Smashwords and D2D. Different things worked at different times. Now I go through D2D primarily for two reasons:  1) I got frustrated with Kobo and Nook for various issues, and 2) I don't want to have to re-upload in half a dozen places every time I make a small change. It takes me more than 10-15 minutes, because I'm OCD about this stuff. Any small change, and I'm going to go completely through the manuscript and check issues in every version.

    Everyone has to find his/her best fit.

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    Offline Not any more

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #18 on: August 23, 2017, 12:15:14 pm »
    IHowever, for an author who is experimenting with wide but might change his or her mind, aggregators can get a book taken down much more rapidly sometimes than individuals can. This is particularly an issue with Kobo, who pushes the books way downstream to all kinds of affiliated bookstores. I could be wrong, but I think all the horrors stories I've heard in that regard came from people who went direct to Kobo.
    Not entirely. When I first went into KU, I had fits trying to get my books off of one of Smashwords' retailers, as well as one of the KOBO downstream outlets (I distributed to KOBO through Smashwords).
     
    This post remains on KBoards over my objections.

    Offline Huldra

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #19 on: August 23, 2017, 12:33:29 pm »
    .
    « Last Edit: September 28, 2018, 12:22:10 am by Huldra »

    Offline Seneca42

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #20 on: August 23, 2017, 12:52:03 pm »
    Perhaps you are looking at it wrong? Many people use D2D and have good things to say about it.

    D2D is great. Just because I don't see the logic in aggregating versus going direct doesn't mean D2D is bad. I use them for B&N and itunes.

    Most people go with D2D either:

    * they don't have a mac and can't upload to itunes without a giant pain in the butt
    * they aren't american, so B&N you can't get on direct
    * want to go beyond the main stores (B&N, itunes and Kobo) to the smaller distributors
    * have been told to use D2D by everyone, so they just do so without researching it

    All I'm saying is "convenience" isn't a reason to go with an aggregator if you're primarily concerned with just the three main stores. In addition, Kobo you definitely want to be direct or you won't have access to their in-house promotions which are awesome (cheap and effective).

    Bill said something interesting though about unpublishing. If it is harder to unpublish if you're direct (which seems counter intuitive to me but could easily be the case) then that's definitely something to consider. Someone else would have to provide insight into that though.

    Let me put it like this? Would you give an aggregator 10% to publish you on Amazon? Hell no, because you know how to do it yourself and how easy it is. It's the same with the other vendors - hell Kobo's upload process is WAY easier than Amazons. 

    Offline Tilly

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #21 on: August 23, 2017, 01:11:52 pm »
    Whatever you decide, wide or direct, make a decision and stick with it.

    I went with D2D at the start a couple of years ago and now, if I want to go direct with Kobo to hook into their promos I have to give up hundreds of reviews my books have there. I will have to wipe all the social proof and also boughts and start again from scratch.

    Offline Lydniz

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #22 on: August 23, 2017, 01:17:07 pm »
    If you are just starting out, I would strongly suggest just biting the bullet and going direct. It's much, much easier to do it now, if you just have a couple of books out, than when you have 15+ books out and realize you don't want to give 10% of your sales to an aggregator. And then realize you have 15+ x backmatter to reformat and upload to 5+ platforms.

    Ask me how I know :D

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    Offline aimeeeasterling

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #23 on: August 26, 2017, 05:17:49 pm »
    How did you get the in store promotion with BN/Nook Press?

    Sorry to be such a slowpoke about answering everybody! It looks like some of the questions for me were kindly fielded by other people. (Yay! :-) ) To answer this one:

    I emailed their help contact on the website and just asked if I could get access to in-store promotions. They gave me links to some Google forms, which I filled out and never heard back about. Then, about eight months later, somebody emailed and asked if I wanted an in-store promotion. I gratefully agreed.

    So, pretty hit or miss. But it's worth trying!

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    Offline Chrissy

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    Re: Cleanest way to go wide
    « Reply #24 on: August 26, 2017, 05:48:15 pm »
    Sorry to be such a slowpoke about answering everybody! It looks like some of the questions for me were kindly fielded by other people. (Yay! :-) ) To answer this one:

    I emailed their help contact on the website and just asked if I could get access to in-store promotions. They gave me links to some Google forms, which I filled out and never heard back about. Then, about eight months later, somebody emailed and asked if I wanted an in-store promotion. I gratefully agreed.

    So, pretty hit or miss. But it's worth trying!

    Thanks!  :)

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