Author Topic: A New AMS Thread  (Read 101150 times)  

Offline Megan Crewe

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Re: A New AMS Thread
« Reply #150 on: November 06, 2017, 08:27:30 pm »
I threw a couple low-bid PD ads up about a week ago and just checked them and they all have less than 100 impressions right now. I haven't read the book that says this, but from other comments in the thread, it can take 4-6 weeks for a low PD ad to start running. If you want them to run faster, I've had success bumping up the bids. I don't know where you've set yours, but Amazon did just send out a guide to AMS this last week recommending that people bump their bids for the holiday season, so what might've been a high bid two weeks ago may no longer be high enough.

I just put them up to $1 for one and $0.80 for the others this morning. No new impressions since then. If I'd have to pay more than that per click then it's definite not worth it, as I'd only be making $2 per sale and even 1 out of 2 clicks resulting in a purchase would be an incredible result. :P It's too bad, because I was really hoping to at least A/B test some different ad text.

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    Offline Philip Gibson

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #151 on: November 07, 2017, 04:23:06 pm »
    Many have observed that using identical keywords in different ads results in one ad gaining impressions and the others gaining no or very few impressions/clicks.

    I also have found that to be the case.  Except when it isn't. As is the case with my most successful ads.

    Two months ago, I set up 3 Sponsored Products ads on a single book.  I used 48 identical keywords which had performed well in previous ads.  Bids per click were identical - $0.16.  The only difference between the three ads was different ad copy for each.  Results so far are:

    Ad 1:  585,245 impressions.  1,444 clicks.  38 sales.  $0.10 per click.

    Ad. 2: 307,645 impressions.  709 clicks.     27 sales.  $0.10 per click.

    Ad 3:  183,551 impressions.   474 clicks.    19 sales.  $0.15 per click.

    Ad 3 would have had many more impressions/clicks had I not paused it for 10 days (due to its high cost per click compared to the other ads) when it was the best performing of the three ads.

    So, like much of AMS, certain things apply.

    Except when they don't.

    Philip
    « Last Edit: November 07, 2017, 05:31:43 pm by Philip Gibson »

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    Offline A past poster

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #152 on: November 08, 2017, 03:04:25 pm »
    I haven't done much tweaking with my Sponsored Manual Ads. Several days ago, I raised bids on keywords that had been producing sales when I saw they weren't on the first pages of the carousels. My sales have been down. When I checked the carousels this morning, I raised keyword bids again. Late this afternoon,  my books were still not on the carousels for those keywords (book titles). What is so puzzling is that one of the carousels had 11 pages, and the last page had room for another book.  My latest bid is 0.41 cents, yet it wasn't on the carousel, even on the last page. In another instance, the carousel had 10 pages, and the last page had only one sponsored ad on it. Has anyone else seen this?
    « Last Edit: November 08, 2017, 05:56:00 pm by Marian »

    Offline Laran Mithras

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #153 on: November 08, 2017, 05:36:56 pm »
    What I'm seeing is complete disillusion with AMS. I don't want to wreck the thread with negativity.

    Offline IntoTheAbyss

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #154 on: November 09, 2017, 12:54:56 am »
    What I'm seeing is complete disillusion with AMS. I don't want to wreck the thread with negativity.

    That's how I feel about them for a variety of reasons.

    Offline BillyDeCarlo

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #155 on: November 09, 2017, 03:46:00 am »
    What I'm seeing is complete disillusion with AMS. I don't want to wreck the thread with negativity.

    I think there's been plenty of well-deserved negativity about AMS ads, especially lately. If they basically hadn't stopped spending my money recently, I'd do away with them altogether. I'm spending my ad money elsewhere. It's a shame they don't overhaul the whole thing. They could make a lot more money if they had something reliable and usable.


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    Offline Bob Stewart

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #156 on: November 09, 2017, 06:31:13 am »
    I read the Meeks book and put up a PDP ad and a PDI ad at low bid. They sat without any activity about a month. I changed the bids to .59 and two weeks later one has 221 impressions and the other (product display by interest) has just one...

    My experience is similar to Billy's.

    Can anyone provide current bids which are working on Product Display ads?

    When I create an ad, AMS will tell me "Average bid is $0.15 to $0.20", but even if I set the bid to $.75, I see nothing, or next to nothing.

    Have people just bid these up to to ridiculously high CPCs?

    I never had much success with Facebook ads, but their ad manager was 10,000 more useful than AMS. If it said to bid  $.50, I would see some results there. And if I tweaked the ad, I could see the result within hours.

    I don't see how anyone can use this with any efficiency.

    Offline Accord64

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #157 on: November 09, 2017, 06:57:46 am »
    What I'm seeing is complete disillusion with AMS. I don't want to wreck the thread with negativity.

    I don't want to crap on AMS either, because it's basically the only promo service that allows you to run ads at full retail - and right on Amazon. Most (if not all) other promo services require your book to be free or discounted.

    However, my experience with AMS continues to spiral downward. Too many issues to list.

    Maybe this is nothing, but there's currently a planned maintenance outage scheduled for tonight. I know they did this recently and many of us got hopeful that perhaps they'd roll out some positive changes. I like to be hopeful this time around, too, but the Zon has a way of consistently letting me down.  :(         

    Offline CassieL

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #158 on: November 09, 2017, 07:28:16 am »
    Edited to say: Sorry guys. Based on new ownership at this site and their response to legitimate author concerns I've chosen to withdraw from participation here.
    « Last Edit: September 20, 2018, 11:16:58 am by Cassie Leigh »

    8 Pen Names. Genres: Non-fiction, Speculative Fiction, Romance.

    Offline Sam Kates

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #159 on: November 09, 2017, 08:24:30 am »

    Can anyone provide current bids which are working on Product Display ads?

    When I create an ad, AMS will tell me "Average bid is $0.15 to $0.20", but even if I set the bid to $.75, I see nothing, or next to nothing.

    Have people just bid these up to to ridiculously high CPCs?


    I'm running one at the moment with a bid price of $0.40. It's been running for a week, but the impressions only kicked in after a day or two, so around five days of the ad being active. It currently has around 700 impressions and 7 clicks. This is the first time I've run an AMS ad so have no idea how good, bad or indifferent that is.

    Offline IntoTheAbyss

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #160 on: November 09, 2017, 01:28:18 pm »

    Can anyone provide current bids which are working on Product Display ads?

    When I create an ad, AMS will tell me "Average bid is $0.15 to $0.20", but even if I set the bid to $.75, I see nothing, or next to nothing.

    Have people just bid these up to to ridiculously high CPCs?


    Set bid to .75 cents. Spent over 14 dollars in half a day with 58 cent a click. Lowered bid. Can't justify that cost when I won't know for three days if it led to anything. It probably depends on genre too. The romance genre has a lot of traffic, so more chances for PD ads to run.

    Offline 39416

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #161 on: November 09, 2017, 04:17:46 pm »
    When I first started doing AMS ads I made money from them. Then it started shifting and it eventually came to where very consistently, whatever I spent on the ads, that's how much money I earned in page reads and sales from the ads. In other words, I sold books but Amazon took all the money. I just now finished another bout of ads and for the first time I actually lost money. It was only two dollars, but sheesh, I'm getting nothing for my page reads and sales AND I'm left in the hole from it?

    I'm going to try running some ads once more next month and if the same thing happens I think that will be it for me and AMS ads. All I can think of is that the structure must now be for bigger fish than me.

    Offline A past poster

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #162 on: November 09, 2017, 06:33:22 pm »

    Set bid to .75 cents. Spent over 14 dollars in half a day with 58 cent a click. Lowered bid. Can't justify that cost when I won't know for three days if it led to anything. It probably depends on genre too. The romance genre has a lot of traffic, so more chances for PD ads to run.
    You'll know your daily sales if you check your Amazon report. It's the best way I've found to keep track of sales and spend for each day. Click the "Orders" tab on the Excel sheet, and you'll see how many books were sold.

    Offline Megan Crewe

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #163 on: November 10, 2017, 06:42:25 am »
    Update on Product Display bidding--upped my bids to $1 and $0.8 on four ads four days ago. The numbers started showing this morning. The one $1 bid has gotten me 3600 views so far; the three $0.80 bids have only gotten about 40 views each. :P So I guess even $0.80 isn't enough to get much traction.

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    Offline 98368

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #164 on: November 10, 2017, 07:06:36 am »
    Apologies if this has already been asked in this thread or elsewhere, but I haven't seen it addressed.

    In an AMS SP ad, I understand that I'm not allowed to quote directly from customer reviews, however, it seems like I'm allowed to quote from these selfsame reviews if I first quote these reviews in the book description. At least that's the impression I get from a few back-and-forths I've had with AMS, although every time they write to me, their responses get so bogged down in jargon that I actually have no idea what is and isn't allowed. And no one I've spoken to on the phone at KDP knows the answer to this question.

    Does someone here know? I'm not looking to game the system--I'm just trying to understand what the heck I can and can't do. Really, I saw no obvious harm in quoting from customer reviews. It seemed an obvious advertising strategy. Yet AMS doesn't allow it.

    Thanks in advance for any info.

    Offline 98368

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #165 on: November 10, 2017, 07:45:14 am »
    Thanks, LilyBLily. I guess I figured fair use would cover the use of a couple of words inside quote marks. If anyone else has experience with this, I'd appreciate your input. Thanks.

    Offline Philip Gibson

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #166 on: November 10, 2017, 09:37:28 am »
    I'm currently running 24 Sponsored Products ads and all are in profit with an average return on investment of 65%.  I've had no success with Product Display ads and no longer run them.

    My average keyword bid across the ads is $0.16.  Average spend per click is $0.10.  I monitor and tweak the ads daily, upping and lowering bids, stopping and re-posting non-performing ads with different ad copy or keyword bid, etc.  It feels a lot like gardening.

    All my ads are box sets that are in series of box sets which have significant sell-through.  I've never made a consistent profit with ads on low-priced, single volume, standalone books.

    Philip
    « Last Edit: November 10, 2017, 11:17:42 am by Philip Gibson »

    What if there had been social media during important historical events?
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    Offline Bob Stewart

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #167 on: November 10, 2017, 11:00:33 am »
    OK, I ran a variety of Product Display ads, targeting individual books, categories, etc., gradually upping the CPC until I got some results. Across the board, the average CPC paid is $.59-.67.

    I don't see how anyone can improve on this much, unless they are in a very uncompetitive category and target an unexpectedly popular book.

    For Sponsored Product ads, targeting identical authors, analogous topics, etc., my average CPC is $.10-.13.

    Since it's reasonable to assume visitors coming either way are equally likely to buy, Product Display ads simply cost five times what Sponsored Product ads cost, and usually far more than what one is likely to earn in royalties.

    Either certain people have some phenomenal conversion rates, or Product Display ads have been bid up to the point of absurdity.

    Offline Philip Gibson

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #168 on: November 10, 2017, 11:34:15 am »
    On running Sponsored Product ads with low bids.

    I average 30-40 clicks per sale at an average cost per click of $0.10.  This nets me a good profit on my $6.99 box sets due to sell-through and paperback sales of my children's books.

    I'd like to do a thought experiment to see the benefit of multiple ads with low cost bids compared to a single ad with high cost bids.  Say I need 40 clicks to make a sale in either case. 

    Case A: I run one ad at $0.20 per click. Therefore, I spend $8 ($0.20 x 40) to make a sale.

    Case B: I run ten ads at $0.10 per click.  40 clicks = 4 clicks per ad. I spend $0.40 per ad. So 40 clicks = $4 ($0.40 x 10) to make a sale.

    Does this make sense?  Am I missing something? What should I conclude from this?

    Philip
    « Last Edit: November 10, 2017, 11:37:03 am by Philip Gibson »

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    Offline Laran Mithras

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #169 on: November 11, 2017, 03:32:13 pm »
    I terminated all of my AMS ads. Have never seen a profit no matter how I chased keyword culling. I'm likely too small-time to see any benefit.

    Offline Jena H

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #170 on: November 11, 2017, 05:30:57 pm »
    I unpaused two ads the other day, with some tweaks to keywords.  So far I'm not seeing any activity at all from one ad, but the other is showing signs of life.  (For now, at least.)  ANyway, at the moment, the keywords with the most impressions aren't the ones that have generated sales--not by a long shot.

    For whatever it's worth, the keywords with the highest number of impressions by far are other author names and book series that are similar to mine, or have a similar audience.  And yet...  no sales from those high-impression keywords.  Instead--and I repeat that this is so far, as things could change-- the successful keywords are very generic ones related to genre: historical fiction, American history, etc.  There is one keyword of a book series title that has led to a sale, but it has less than 700 impressions, so that one sale might just be a lucky fluke.  (Hey, I'll take it, lucky flukes are still lucky.   ;)
    Jena

    Offline weigle1234

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #171 on: November 11, 2017, 10:03:52 pm »
    On running Sponsored Product ads with low bids.

    I average 30-40 clicks per sale at an average cost per click of $0.10.  This nets me a good profit on my $6.99 box sets due to sell-through and paperback sales of my children's books.

    I'd like to do a thought experiment to see the benefit of multiple ads with low cost bids compared to a single ad with high cost bids.  Say I need 40 clicks to make a sale in either case. 

    Case A: I run one ad at $0.20 per click. Therefore, I spend $8 ($0.20 x 40) to make a sale.

    Case B: I run ten ads at $0.10 per click.  40 clicks = 4 clicks per ad. I spend $0.40 per ad. So 40 clicks = $4 ($0.40 x 10) to make a sale.

    Does this make sense?  Am I missing something? What should I conclude from this?

    Philip

    If you are running multiple ads, does your Advertising Campaign chart reflect specific sales for each individual ad?  If not, it is impossible to evaluate individual ad performance.

    Without that all-important information, it is easy to be naively lulled into believing total ad performance reflects reality.  Let us assume, for example, you are running 10 ads which have generated 10 sales.  Obviously, that is an overall average of 1 sale for each ad.  However, it may well be that 1 ad alone generated all 10 sales.  Running the other 9 ads is nothing but wasted money (and time).

    In reality, the chances that all 10 ads are performing equally is unlikely (most likely impossible).  Without accurate individual sales data from our Advertising Campaign chart, running multiple ads is but a guessing game (a poor way to try to turn a profit, or to attempt to run any business).

    Offline Philip Gibson

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #172 on: November 12, 2017, 04:54:38 am »
    If you are running multiple ads, does your Advertising Campaign chart reflect specific sales for each individual ad?  If not, it is impossible to evaluate individual ad performance.

    Without that all-important information, it is easy to be naively lulled into believing total ad performance reflects reality.  Let us assume, for example, you are running 10 ads which have generated 10 sales.  Obviously, that is an overall average of 1 sale for each ad.  However, it may well be that 1 ad alone generated all 10 sales.  Running the other 9 ads is nothing but wasted money (and time).

    In reality, the chances that all 10 ads are performing equally is unlikely (most likely impossible).  Without accurate individual sales data from our Advertising Campaign chart, running multiple ads is but a guessing game (a poor way to try to turn a profit, or to attempt to run any business).

    Good question.

    I believe I am able to evaluate the performance of individual ads to a fairly accurate degree by using both my (accurate and timely) KDP sales dashboard and the (delayed and only partly accurate) AMS reporting.  I keep a daily record of the $ amounts reported by each ad and, using the list prices of individual books (ebooks and paperbacks), and looking at both the KDP and AMS reporting, can fairly accurately calculate the number of sales per day each ad is generating over time.

    Although the AMS sales reporting is not reliable as to $ amounts and can't take into account sell-through, read-through and borrows, I believe it can serve a 'binary' function in that it tells me if that ad has had sales or no sales at all over a sustained period.  If that reporting for an ad does report sales over a period of several days, I give it an asterisk (*) in my own sales reporting table.

    If an ad gets no asterisks for 10 days or more, I can fairly confidently assume that ad is not working.  In the case I think the keywords for that ad are worth sticking with, I repackage the ad, i.e. I change the ad copy and/or bid and submit a new ad.

    I also monitor the ranking of the books being advertised and, using the 'rank-to-sales/borrows' chart am able to gauge how many borrows a campaign is generating, although that is at the campaign level - it can't tell me the effect individual ads are having on borrows.

    Philip
    « Last Edit: November 12, 2017, 05:16:47 am by Philip Gibson »

    What if there had been social media during important historical events?
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    Offline Accord64

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #173 on: November 12, 2017, 10:06:49 am »
    Ugh!  :o

    I launched two sponsored product ads (for two different books) a few days ago, and both have performed horrendously. They are easily tied with each other for the worst performers in my AMS experience.

    In the past, these ads (same keywords and bid prices) have consistently recorded tens of thousands impressions, dozens of clicks, and a few sales during the first few days. Instead, each has under 1500 impressions and only one click between them.

    Either AMS is hyper-competitive right now or I didn't make enough sacrifices to the AMS algorithm gods. Both ads have stalled so I might just terminate them early.

    On the positive side, they only cost me 25 cents.

    Anyone else seeing similar trends? 

    Offline It's A Mystery

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    Re: A New AMS Thread
    « Reply #174 on: November 12, 2017, 11:28:06 am »
    I feel bad for you, but I'm not sure a few days is enough data. I've seen loads of reports that say you have to be more patient to see results.

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