Author Topic: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!  (Read 2902 times)  

Offline Elk

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Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
« Reply #25 on: September 15, 2020, 06:54:18 am »
Sharing movies or music online wasn't really practical in those days. 
. . .
So piracy had to wait till there was enough bandwidth except for ebooks, which were small enough to transfer.

Actually, and I'm just guessing now, I suspect that illegal (or more correctly, sue-able) sharing slowed considerably when it became possible to buy ebooks. 
. . .

These days we can get ebooks and movies and TV shows and music legally so piracy would be a bit silly.  I suspect if any of these media became unavailable piracy would go sky high.

Bandwidth was indeed an issue.  This limitation is what led to the creation of the MP3 format which, in turn, allowed music piracy as one could now share reasonably sized files. 

While I would like to believe easily available legal sources would cut down on piracy, this does not appear to be true. Even though music streaming is readily available and popular, one-third of music consumers still pirate.  Similarly, movie piracy during COVID lockdown has surged to unprecedented levels, up by 41% in the US in the final week of March 2020 versus the same period of the prior month.  Scary.

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    Offline Elk

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #26 on: September 15, 2020, 07:00:28 am »
    You ought to go back to the early days and read the plethora of posts and discussions that took place on here with respect to DRM and archival copies and Fair Use doctrine. We had some rather lengthy and interesting discussions on the matter...
    I recall, and was actively involved. 

    The denizens here tended to either be fascinated or annoyed by the discussions.

    Offline binaryhermit

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #27 on: September 26, 2020, 09:59:58 pm »
    What I think would be cool would be an eReader vaguely like a Surface duo except with eInk screens.  They'd probably need to be smaller and a different aspect ratio, though.

    But since eReaders are largely dead sales-wise, the odds of any revolutionary new form factor are pretty slim.

    Offline Elk

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #28 on: September 27, 2020, 06:20:01 am »
    Agreed; the Kindle which is available now is likely to be pretty much the last, other than minor revisions.


    Offline barryem

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #29 on: September 27, 2020, 07:39:43 am »
    While I would like to believe easily available legal sources would cut down on piracy, this does not appear to be true. Even though music streaming is readily available and popular, one-third of music consumers still pirate.  Similarly, movie piracy during COVID lockdown has surged to unprecedented levels, up by 41% in the US in the final week of March 2020 versus the same period of the prior month.

    I haven't heard that about 1/3 of music consumers pirating but I am pretty sure that if those numbers came from publishers they're mostly hype.  Publishers love to exaggerate the extent of piracy, usually by factors of 10 or more.  Of course I don't know the source of that number.

    As for piracy increasing during the lockdown I think that's pretty natural.  People stuck at home want entertainment and a lot of them don't have their usual incomes.  I realize publishers have to care about this but personally I don't see anything very wrong about it.  It's an extreme situation.

    People should pay for their entertainment if they can pay for it.  If they can't they still want to be entertained and they need it.

    I grew up pretty poor and I remember my brother and I climbing up onto the roof of our house to watch movies at the drive-in theater a couple of blocks away.  We couldn't hear it but we could watch and make up stuff about what was being said.  I guess that was my earliest involvement with piracy. :)

    When I was about 14 I began sneaking into that drive-in to watch movies.  I got caught about 90% of the time and they made me peel potatoes and then let me watch the movie.  I was about 15 when I learned to just offer to peel potatoes to get to watch.  They always let me. :)

    My parents always bought books.  Both of them loved to read and I'd read their books when they were done.  When I was done we'd give them to our neighbor, who would also give us any books he had finished.  Sharing books was neighborly; friendly; decent.  It was just being a good person.  I've never lost that feeling.

    I do recognize that electronic copying means books can multiply and be shared among a lot more people, but that's true of libraries as well.

    As a moderately honest person I do think we should pay for what we get.  If we don't, in the long run we won't have as much available to us.  That's a real thing and an important thing.  And the fact that the publishers are so dishonest so often: V.C. Andrews has written far more books since her death than before, as has Robert Ludlum.  Either this is God giving special access to publishers or they're putting one over on us.  And look at James Patterson, who has a stable of writers writing James Patterson books.

    I used to pay 10 cents for nearly all my paperbacks in 1955 at the drugstore book rack.  These were all brand new books; things like Perry Mason, Frank Yerby, John Steinbeck, etc.  The inflation calculator says that 10 cents in 1955 should be 96 cents in today's money.  Will someone point out the 96 cent paperback stand to me, please?  I can't seem to find it. :)

    That's not to say publishers are crooks.  They're not!  They're hardcore businessmen doing what I'd probably do if I was a hardcore businessman.  Actually my brother is one, although he's retired now.  He always insists that if you don't say untrue words you haven't told a lie even if your words are carefully constructed to make someone believe something that isn't true.

    I invented a situation years ago and we've been arguing about it ever since:  a used car salesman gets in an old clunker that he knows is on it's last legs but it actually looks pretty good.  He calls his grandmother and asks her to come drive it to the grocery store, which she does.  Later, when selling the car to a young couple he tells them the car was driven by a nice old lady to the grocery store and that convinces them it must have been well treated and they buy it.

    I insist that the salesman lied and cheated his customer.  My brother can't see that he's done anything wrong.  I think publishers lie and cheat their customers but I'm sure that like my brother, they don't do anything they think is wrong.  Our morality adjusts to fit our circumstances.

    I do think most pirates are as honest as most publishers.  I also think the availability of legal books does keep down piracy although the publishers will never admit it.  And I think if the publishers were more honest they'd have even less piracy.

    Barry

    Offline Elk

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #30 on: September 27, 2020, 04:50:05 pm »
    People should pay for their entertainment if they can pay for it.  If they can't they still want to be entertained and they need it.
    Wanting to be entertained does not justify theft. 

    Quote
    Both of them loved to read and I'd read their books when they were done.  When I was done we'd give them to our neighbor, who would also give us any books he had finished.  Sharing books was neighborly; friendly; decent.  It was just being a good person. 
    I completely agree.  Letting someone borrow a book is a wonderful thing.  But loaning your one physical copy is completely appropriate and very different from making an illicit copy and passing the copy on.

    Quote
    I do recognize that electronic copying means books can multiply and be shared among a lot more people, but that's true of libraries as well.
    Libraries buy a license for each copy they loan.

    Quote
    I also think the availability of legal books does keep down piracy although the publishers will never admit it. 
    I am not following.  Please expand on this a bit. I usually understand what you are getting at.

    Offline barryem

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #31 on: September 27, 2020, 06:30:36 pm »
    >> I also think the availability of legal books does keep down piracy although the publishers will never admit it.

    I am not following.  Please expand on this a bit. I usually understand what you are getting at.

    I think publishers have a kind of odd situation.  They make more money on print books than ebooks, or, probably more accurately, they'll make more money in the future if print is the most common kind of book and ebooks are just used occasionally.  This is because it cost less to make ebooks and distribute them and a percent of $20 is more than a percent of $10 or even less.  Remember how many years Amazon was able to sell ebooks, even best sellers, for under $10 until the publishers put an end to that.  I'm sure Amazon would have eventually raised the prices themselves if they'd been losing money, and that was while having to give something back to the publishers because so many books were selling below cost.

    So publishers do everything they can to make print books seem like real books and ebooks something less.  In the meantime they've developed methods, some illegal if you recall the price fixing trial involving Apple and the big 5.

    Publishers have to sell us ebooks because there's so much demand but they do everything they can to reduce the demand, mostly by controlling prices and in recent years fighting against distributing through libraries.

    We live in a capitalist economy and that's a very good thing and all of this is part of how capitalism works.  But there are a lot of problems with ebooks that really make very little sense.

    By the way, I do share my ebooks with my neighbors in my retirement home.  Not so much recently because the other tenants at the moment aren't big readers, but that'll change.  The readers come and go.  I share by having spare Kindles that I can put a book onto and then I loan the Kindle.  I have called Amazon and asked if that's okay and I've been assured that it is.  My Amazon account is very important to me and I don't want to put it at risk.

    Barry



    Offline binaryhermit

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #32 on: September 27, 2020, 09:18:02 pm »
    I mean, it's not like tpeople were making unofficial ebooks of in-copyright paper books before there were legally licensed ebooks.


    It's funny, apparently the publishers made more money per copy with Amazon's wholesale business model than they do under the current agency model.  Not to mention they likely sold more copies that way as well.

    Now all they're doing is pushing people to cheaper, perhaps inferior, perhaps not, indie books.

    Offline barryem

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #33 on: September 28, 2020, 05:07:15 am »
    I mean, it's not like tpeople were making unofficial ebooks of in-copyright paper books before there were legally licensed ebooks.

    That's exactly what people did before they (we) could buy ebooks.  That's what made ebooks popular and created the audience that made companies like Mobipocket and Ereader.com, etc. begin selling ebooks.  They saw that there was an audience and they tried to satisfy it and they did.

    The thing is the people sharing ebooks on Compuserve and the internet weren't pirates in the sense we mean today.  They were people who bought books, scanned and proofed them, a lot of work, and shared them.  No-one thought of this as illegal.  It was just sharing books.  Even the sites that stored them to make sharing possible thought they were doing a good thing.  Legality was never considered.  That came later when it began to be done commercially by companies like Mobipocket.

    Barry

    Offline Elk

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #34 on: September 28, 2020, 09:17:34 am »
    They make more money on print books than ebooks, or, probably more accurately, they'll make more money in the future if print is the most common kind of book and ebooks are just used occasionally.

    Thanks for the explanation.  I now understand what you mean.

    Offline Elk

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #35 on: September 28, 2020, 09:29:55 am »
    Legality was never considered. 
    This was simply out of ignorance; people did not know/understand they were stealing.

    Copyright holders started to actively object when piracy became significant with the advent of the Internet, with the concomitant ease and popularity of piracy.

    Piracy was of little consequence when cassette mix tapes could be constructed in real time only, recording songs off of multiple vinyl albums.  It took similar effort to make copies of books. Neither was thus any threat to copyright holders at the time.

    As an aside, sadly there appears to be a connection between ease of copying and the belief an artistic product has little value.  Music, books, film are viewed by many as "free."   

    Offline jkingrph

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #36 on: September 28, 2020, 02:08:33 pm »
    I'm just the opposite about the size of the screen.  I remember reading an article 30 or 40 years ago about why newspaper columns are so narrow.  It said that studies have shown that people read faster and more easily with better comprehension with narrow columns and that newspapers tried to accommodate that.  I don't recall where I read it so I can't really comment on the validity of the article but I remember at the time it made sense to me.

    Reading on my phone does seem faster to me although I never actually tried measuring that.  Now that I'm reading on my Paperwhite I've widened the margins so the text column is narrow as possible, although it's not quite as narrow as my phone's text.

    I did compare the width of the text line on my phone to a newspaper column and it was slightly wider.  I don't recall how much but I think it was about 1/8" wider than the text in the newspaper.  My phone has a 5" screen.

    I wish I had a Kindle with e-ink the size of my phone.  Using wide margins on my Kindle does help a lot though.  If anyone knows a way to shrink a Paperwhite please let me know. :)

    Barry


    Newspapers in the past were much easier to read.   The last few years our local paper has gotten the print so small and smaller means more faint so my old eyes have trouble reading it , so much so I am about to the point of discontinuing the paper.  I did look back at some old columns, articles from 20 or so years back and verified that, the print was larger and bolder.

    Offline Ann in Arlington

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #37 on: September 28, 2020, 02:29:08 pm »
    Newspapers in the past were much easier to read.   The last few years our local paper has gotten the print so small and smaller means more faint so my old eyes have trouble reading it , so much so I am about to the point of discontinuing the paper.  I did look back at some old columns, articles from 20 or so years back and verified that, the print was larger and bolder.

    I've always felt newspapers were uncomfortable to read. Not just the print size -- which has never been very big -- but the fact of the format: Big flappy pages that don't stay still. Ink that rubs off on your fingers. Never a fan. But with Kindle I read the local paper every day. Soooo much better. :)
    My Kindles
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    Offline LDB

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #38 on: September 28, 2020, 06:30:03 pm »
    The Houston Chronicle over the past maybe decade or so has reduced from 6 columns per page to 5 columns so the paper is significantly narrower. I think they also cut it down 2 inches in height as well. And smaller font. My dad subscribed to it his entire lifetime. I don't think they reduced the size before he passed in 2012 though.
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    Offline binaryhermit

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #39 on: September 28, 2020, 07:08:58 pm »
    I suspect the dying newspaper companies are doing all they can to cut costs.

    I mean, look at newspapers today vs, say, 25 years ago, there's fewer sections and the sections that still exist are way thinner.

    Offline LDB

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #40 on: September 28, 2020, 07:38:30 pm »
    Yes, I suspect the page count is less than half what it was 25 years ago. And for less than half the pages it costs 6 to 8 times as much to buy the paper. Combine the page count and new price and it's at least ten times more expensive net.
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    Offline jkingrph

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #41 on: September 28, 2020, 08:06:33 pm »
    Yes and I remember back in the early 60's a months subscription was only a couple of dollars.  Now it's $12.99 per month, fewer sections, less local and regional news, narrower columns , smaller print, and oh yes, they just recently eliminated the Monday paper so it is only six days per week now.

    Offline binaryhermit

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #42 on: September 28, 2020, 09:18:51 pm »
    Yes, I suspect the page count is less than half what it was 25 years ago. And for less than half the pages it costs 6 to 8 times as much to buy the paper. Combine the page count and new price and it's at least ten times more expensive net.
    I'd guess it's way less than half, like, perhaps less than 10% of the page count.

    Offline Fogeydc

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #43 on: September 29, 2020, 07:27:19 am »
    Yes and I remember back in the early 60's a months subscription was only a couple of dollars.  Now it's $12.99 per month, fewer sections, less local and regional news, narrower columns , smaller print, and oh yes, they just recently eliminated the Monday paper so it is only six days per week now.

    That 60's price may have been only a couple of bucks a week -- but I also remember what I got paid then compared to what I'd get today for the same job (pay grade), or comparing minimum wage to what it is now.

    Papers are slimmed-down in recent times (not just this year) for a variety of reasons.
    Bleeding money & under siege.

    We didn't even have a sports-section (or sports to have news about) for months this year, but it's reappeared since sports started up again.
    The Sunday Travel section has been just 2-3 pages in the back of the arts & style section (no surprise there either).


    Offline KimberlyinMN

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #44 on: September 29, 2020, 08:15:31 am »
    I think Amazon did make a 6" Kindle Fire - although that was a mini tablet, not an e-ink device.

    Barry - I love the ability to scroll on my phone and iPad. I feel like I can read a lot faster and more immersive than tapping to turn the page. I wish we could scroll on the e-readers! Although I suppose the whole screen refresh thing might be affected.

    Offline barryem

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #45 on: September 29, 2020, 01:25:12 pm »
    I doubt we'll see scrolling on ereaders any time soon.  I'm really just guessing but I'd guess that it wouldn't work smoothly and no-one is going to implement it till it does work well.  I guess time will tell.

    Barry

    Offline Elk

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #46 on: October 03, 2020, 06:56:25 am »
    True scrolling of an e-ink screen would be very clunky given today's technology. 

    But it would be reasonable to incorporate, for example, a one-quarter page "turn" where the result is a screen which now shows a quarter page more at the bottom and a quarter page less at the top.

    Offline LDB

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #47 on: October 07, 2020, 06:20:39 am »
    Unicorn sighted! Not the best unicorn by any means, but a unicorn sighting none the less.

    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000485692554.html
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    Offline KimberlyinMN

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #48 on: October 07, 2020, 06:28:04 am »
    The one review sounds like it's a de-horned unicorn. Google translated it to the following:

    Quote
    It's a terrible device. The buttons work through the times. The battery is smaller than the stated capacity. Terrible translation of the menu - to use "on the Russian" is simply impossible. The case is useless. There's only one font. Without over-stitching very slowly works and periodically hangs.

    Unicorn sighted! Not the best unicorn by any means, but a unicorn sighting none the less.

    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000485692554.html


    Offline LDB

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    Re: Smartphone size Kindle!!!!!!
    « Reply #49 on: October 07, 2020, 12:47:08 pm »
    Yeah, a piece of junk, but it fits with the required unicorn desired specs, for those wanting a unicorn. Any unicorn is better than no unicorn at all?
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