[MJWare]

Wow, again!

We aren't talking $50 covers here--$250, $300--that's a lot of money.

It almost seems like there are two Ronnell's (doppelganger, maybe). The one I knew seemed like a great guy.

Thanks for everyone coming forward to share their stories! Hopefully, it will get people to do their homework before picking a cover artists.

I've picked an artist just by looking in someone's book myself. and have just gotten lucky.

[corrected typos: 1 comma, one spelling error 2/15/15]

 

[Keith McArdle]

The Internet is like one massive capital city, and the writing industry, one (fairly close knit) suburb of that city. If someone treats enough people like dirt in that suburb, their business will fail. New business men and women treat their customers like gods, because they want them to come back time and time again (which, if the business person is successful, the customer will).

I don't understand why a businessman would want to sabotage his own business.

 

[ProKindler]

I sent him an email that I wanted a design and he emailed me the prices so you're definitely getting ignored. It sucks that there are people in the world like that.

 

[MJWare]

I sent him an email that I wanted a design and he emailed me the prices so you're definitely getting ignored. It sucks that there are people in the world like that.

J.C! --I had an old blog post with his name on it--I removed it a few days ago.

 

[youmademeloveyou]

I sent him an email that I wanted a design and he emailed me the prices so you're definitely getting ignored. It sucks that there are people in the world like that.

Wow. Just wow. And it is a shame too because he seems talented, aside from the fact that he doesn't seem to like to do revisions. If he were actually professional, he could have a good business.

 

[Shane Murray]

Unfortunately, I don't believe I'm allowed to get into details, but my experience with Ronnell was virtually identical to the original poster's: covers that didn't meet my specifications (he used what appeared to be teenagers as the models for characters that are 33 and 40 years old), and when I asked him to redo (especially on the cover with the 40 year old), he refused and told my publisher that I was difficult to work with and that he didn't see anything wrong with the cover art he'd chosen.

It eventually lead to us deciding to not work with Ronnell on the covers and requesting the $300 deposit back, which he refused to provide, saying we should have known what we were getting when we hired a cheap cover artist.

Throughout all of this, he went incommunicado frequently, with long bouts of not replying to emails to either myself or my publisher, including almost three weeks of no communication because he couldn't be bothered to answer an important question I'd asked him, despite the fact he'd been told the job was a priority that needed to be done as soon as possible (which he'd agreed to before requesting the deposit). There are a lot more details than that, but I don't really believe the details are necessary. Just read the original poster's post and you'll get the basics of what happened.

Needless to say, we decided to go with a new cover artist (Stephanie Mooney), and her covers for the series so far are mindblowingly awesome and I can't wait to reveal them to the world.

Wow. Can we have a sticky warning thread for authors?

 

[Rex Jameson]

Very disappointing. I missed the second thread and had no idea more incidents had happened since the first one that Amanda Hocking eventually responded to on her blog. This guy was once highly recommended.

I've been taken for 25 bucks on these forums by a trusted poster. I can't imagine being taken for 300. I hope each of you finds a designer that treats you right.

 

[marshacanham]

Umm...I kinda sorta can't believe someone would pay the full price up front before even seeing a proof. I never expect to be paid for any of the covers I do until the clients are happy with them. And if it's something I can't do, I tell them up front.

I do remember seeing Ronnell's name and some of his covers and I thought they were pretty good. Such a waste of talent. Who was it who said your honor is the only thing that can't be taken from you, you have to give it away. I think he's thrown his away.

 

[Keith McArdle]

Prokindler,

Thanks for doing that, although it doesn't surprise me.


Marsha,

On his website, he asks for full payment up front. Lesson definitely learned, however. I won't be paying up front again.

 

[T. B. Crattie]

Ryan Sumo did my cover. He's really talented, very professional, and good to work with. Google him.

 

[Chris Northern]

Ryan Sumo did my cover. He's really talented, very professional, and good to work with. Google him.

Keith (I never did ask what his last name is) recently did a cover for me and the guy pretty much defines professionalism. I' in a rush so won't extract the links from my blog - the cover and links are here: http://www.forwardviewmirror.blogspot.co.uk/

Might be nice if a few other good people were recommended here so we can turn this into something positive? Just a thought.

 

[Nell Gavin]

Umm...I kinda sorta can't believe someone would pay the full price up front before even seeing a proof. I never expect to be paid for any of the covers I do until the clients are happy with them. And if it's something I can't do, I tell them up front.

I do remember seeing Ronnell's name and some of his covers and I thought they were pretty good. Such a waste of talent. Who was it who said your honor is the only thing that can't be taken from you, you have to give it away. I think he's thrown his away.

I know, right? My cover artist sends me a Paypal invoice AFTER he delivers the final. Then I tweak it, because I'm just that way, and he's just that easy going. If I run into problems, he still helps, even though he's gotten the money.

 

[NoahMullette-Gillman]

I do a little bit of freelance editing now and then. I do ask for my money up-front through PayPal, but I generally take two or three weeks to do a job, so the client is protected by PayPal's 45 day window.

I don't understand doing business online outside of that window. Unless there was a compelling reason to go past that, I need my 45 day protection window. Otherwise I/one has very little recourse if something goes wrong.

 

[Craig Halloran]

I've used Ronnell on my Zombie series (see below) and he's delivered. I plan on using him to finish this series.

It took some time to get in sync and there was some frustration, but he followed up with me, even though there were some delays.

I don't think he's running a scam.  I find that hard to believe.  There will be times when you will have creative differences on these things
and communication will fall through.  Paying up front is a risk you take.  I've paid up front for many services, and if you don't have a contract,
watch out.  I've been lucky that I haven't got burned, but I haven't always gotten what I thought I paid for either. 

This thread is one thing I like (love) about Kindle boards.  People who provide services on this site know that if they don't follow up everyone will hear
about it.  I've been blessed with all the people I am working with from these boards.  I believe you'll find the best talent here for the best price
compared to anywhere else.  I've saved alot of money by working with all of these entrepeneurs here.

Just my two cents. 

 

[Keith McArdle]

Chris,

Good idea on keeping it positive. I've recently started working with a designer by the name of Najla Qamber. Not only is she extremely professional, she is VERY fast. It's been less than 1 week so far and I have my first proof copy. Absolutely brilliant!


Craig,

I'm glad you had a good experience and that you received what you wanted. There's certainly no doubting that Ronnell's skill is certainly not the problem. Good luck working with him again.

 

[Chris Northern]

Chris,

Good idea on keeping it positive. I've recently started working with a designer by the name of Najla Qamber. Not only is she extremely professional, she is VERY fast. It's been less than 1 week so far and I have my first proof copy. Absolutely brilliant!

I also happily check to see what Karri Klawiter can offer; she can be found here: http://artbykarri.com/

 

[Judi Coltman]

Since we are all chiming in here-- Victorine did my newest cover (see avatar).  She was quick, patient and "Got" what I was looking for.  Her rates are rock bottom and she doesn't ask for payment until the customer is happy.

 

[Tiziano]

One element that may create problems, in my opinion and from experience on several art forums is the ' artiste maudit' mentality, the idea that artists are somehow 'superior' and detached from 'mere' commercial considerations and that 'art for art's sake' trumps everything else including deadlines and client's requests.

People wanting to work in the book cover businness ought, IMO, keep in mind that a cover is a cooperation between client (art director or writer) and visual artist and the aim is, as it has been said, to make the intended audience pick up the book.

Revisions come with the job, the visual artist should definitely bring his/ her expertise into play ('I see what you are trying to do, I think this could work better because...') but the last words are always the client's, and deadlines are there for a reason and should never be blown ever, that is the kiss of death for a visual artist in the industry (unless there has been an unforeseen disaster and the artist has warned the client ASAP), and should be the same in the indie market as well.

Most of us are free-lancers, our reputation is what brings in work and unreliable collegues damage everybody.

 

[George Berger]

Provenance and availability, hell. Not to start up the idiotic "illustrated covers are for kid's books" debate again, but a lot of things, especially if you have a very specific vision, are more easily produced as illustrations than as photomanipulations. Possibly cheaper, too, given the prices some of the top photomanipulators charge.

 

[Greer]

One element that may create problems, in my opinion and from experience on several art forums is the ' artiste maudit' mentality, the idea that artists are somehow 'superior' and detached from 'mere' commercial considerations and that 'art for art's sake' trumps everything else including deadlines and client's requests.

People wanting to work in the book cover businness ought, IMO, keep in mind that a cover is a cooperation between client (art director or writer) and visual artist and the aim is, as it has been said, to make the intended audience pick up the book.

Revisions come with the job, the visual artist should definitely bring his/ her expertise into play ('I see what you are trying to do, I think this could work better because...') but the last words are always the client's, and deadlines are there for a reason and should never be blown ever, that is the kiss of death for a visual artist in the industry (unless there has been an unforeseen disaster and the artist has warned the client ASAP), and should be the same in the indie market as well.

Most of us are free-lancers, our reputation is what brings in work and unreliable collegues damage everybody.

THIS! Oh, this. We were part of a group a few years back where this argument came up on a very regular basis, got quite heated, and got us all absolutely nowhere. Coming from the perspective of art being important, sure - the integrity of the art is number one. But from a business perspective? If the client can't use the work they've paid for, screw the art and the artists' integrity. The finished product (and that is what it is, a product) does no one any good except the artist and his/her ego. Continuing to operate in that mentality does not bring you clients, it does gain you a reputation as a diva, and pretty soon, the quality of your art is a moot point. That's something we could never convince certain members of this group, and we moved on. It was a bit more complicated than that, but it was a small deciding factor.

This is so very true. It doesn't matter how beautiful the artwork, or how great the artist - if a customer can't use, or never gets, the art that they paid for, it doesn't do them any good at all.

And every time an artist pulls the diva act, or another artist defends diva behavior as being okay because artists are special, it tends to tar all artists with the same brush, and make us look like unreliable flakes who can't be counted on to deliver the product we promised.