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Hey, I was wondering if books still get significant organic visibility in the first thirty days after release. Is there still a "90 day cliff" or something equivalent - and does releasing books on a regular monthly or bi-monthly schedule still get results? Or is it all in the ads these days?
 

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I'm interested  in knowing about this too. Does a new book get a special announcement on Amazon and how long does that last? I never paid much attention to it.
 

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IMO, the cliffs are tighter now. Instead of 30 days, you're probably looking at 25.

For the 30 days, I'd say the algo is completely ignoring you by day 30, but probably starts letting go of you well before that.

chrisstevenson said:
Does a new book get a special announcement on Amazon and how long does that last?
No, when a book goes live it gets a little love from the algo. And it loves you for a few weeks, but only a bit. If your book is showing significant movement, you attract the algos attention, and it loves you a bit more. But bot love dies, and it's entirely forgotten you exist at 30 days. (ETA. If you can keep momentum on your books, with ads or however, you can keep the bot's attention.)

This is all a significant part of the quick release scheme. If you can manage it, and have something out ever 30 days, you always have a bot circling and boosting you.
 

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For erotica, it's about seven days now (or so I've read). For other genres, as ImaWriter said, it's pretty much gone before 30 days, unless you make really good sales. The algos always favor good sales, especially in a short period of time.
 

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EmparentingMom said:
Hey, I was wondering if books still get significant organic visibility in the first thirty days after release. Is there still a "90 day cliff" or something equivalent - and does releasing books on a regular monthly or bi-monthly schedule still get results? Or is it all in the ads these days?
I can only really address the first part:
Organic? Nope. Organic is dead. You have to have some sort of advertising or outside traffic running to your book.

The first 30 days isn't a cliff, so much as a window of opportunity.
That first 30 days is critical to the long term success of your book. YOU have to send traffic and sales to your book, and the traffic you send in that first 30 days better be spot on. As in, think about what authors you want in your also boughts, spot on. This is the window where you teach Amazon who to sell your book to, what your ideal reader looks like. I am also convinced sending this outside traffic during this time also kicks your AMS ads on and gets them to serve.

The good news is, if you nail this, it will serve you very well for a long time and, combined with a low budget AMS ad and an occasional Kindle Countdown deal, you might get sticky and never go off the cliff.
 

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I think the "Hot New Release" listing helps. It's far easier to make this 1st 30 day list early with less days diluting ranking. So the earlier the better. But in a marketing launch strategy, you have to balance this with accumulated ARC reviews. Less reviews may also decrease sales.

As far as getting at the top of searches and stuff, I have no idea how the bots work. Wish I did. Is it 30 days, 90??
 

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alhawke said:
As far as getting at the top of searches and stuff, I have no idea how the bots work.
I think this is largely driven by sales. As in if there is a good chance the book will be purchased (because it has proven to be popular) it will be at the top. That's just smart marketing, and the bot/algo will know that. Books that have no traction and nobody appears to care about aren't going to get top spots.

It's pretty much like trying to get a job when you have no experience. You need the job first to get the experience. You want the algo to place you at the top so you can get sales, but it's leaving you at the bottom because you have none. Classic conundrum!
 

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EmparentingMom said:
Hey, I was wondering if books still get significant organic visibility in the first thirty days after release. Is there still a "90 day cliff" or something equivalent - and does releasing books on a regular monthly or bi-monthly schedule still get results? Or is it all in the ads these days?
Personally, I think it's more like 2 weeks instead of 30 days these days, and a complete drop off happens more like two months in.
 

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ImaWriter said:
I think this is largely driven by sales. As in if there is a good chance the book will be purchased (because it has proven to be popular) it will be at the top. That's just smart marketing, and the bot/algo will know that. Books that have no traction and nobody appears to care about aren't going to get top spots.

It's pretty much like trying to get a job when you have no experience. You need the job first to get the experience. You want the algo to place you at the top so you can get sales, but it's leaving you at the bottom because you have none. Classic conundrum!
I agree that this seems to be (majorly) a performance issue that starts right after the release. It's a bot/marketing decision, or auto pick, more precisely. You can probably spike high with sales out of the gate, but the trick is to stay there, or progress with an upward sales trend.
 

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I would think that the current state of the economy is also affecting whatever 'cliff' the algo provides. The economy is a factor in overall sales, if all other factors are equal (book quality, frequency of releases, etc.). And the economy is precarious right now.
 

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There's a lot that goes into how the Algorithms work, probably more than you think. Amazon is selling the real estate of the book listings - and as with AMS - the best spots go to the best books for Amazon to sell. That means Author "A" can have a 99-cent book selling 100 copies per day and Amazon gets a gross of 70%, or $70. Where does that fit with other books? Well, a $2.99 book where Amazon gets a gross of 90-cents each only has to sell 79 to be more advantageous for Amazon to list first ($71). Likewise, a $9.99 book that Amazon gets $3 per only has to sell 24 copies to step in front of that book selling 100 copies. Now, drill deeper:

Amazon knows their buyer's buying habits, so the person paying less per book gets more in their price range, while the person who buys exclusively $9.99 and higher gets many more listed before that 100-copy book appears. And deeper:

Amazon knows the also boughts, so you'll get more in the genre you like, you'll get more in a price-range and genre that pays them more, meaning if you search a Dog-lover book where the also boughts lean heavily on crime-fiction, well, you'll get plenty of those in whatever price-range Amazon makes the most in. And, it they can convince you to buy a popular "first-in-series" book, they've done their job because they know if you'll spend more with a series than with random stand-alones. Basically, they know everything. We are sheep.
 
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