Would folders capability require a hardware or a software upgrade?

4446 Views 39 Replies 14 Participants Last post by stevene9, Feb 20, 2009

deMoMo

Discussion Starter · Feb 18, 2009

So, I don't actually have NelsontheKindle in my hot little hands yet, but I've been reading various things, and it sounds like people are disappointed that the K2 doesn't include folder capability.

I've been thinking about it, and it seems to me that the folders would be strictly a software upgrade, it wouldn't require any hardware changes. If that's the case, then that means that it's still possible that the K2 (and even the original Kindle!) could have folders in the future.

Any thoughts on that from people more technologically savvy than I am?

1 - 20 of 40 Posts

stevene9

· #2 · Feb 18, 2009

To get folders doesn't require a hardware update, it doesn't require a software update, it requires a miracle.

Steve

mwvickers

· #3 · Feb 18, 2009

stevene9 said:
To get folders doesn't require a hardware update, it doesn't require a software update, it requires a miracle.

Steve

Now that's funny.

SusanCassidy

· #4 · Feb 18, 2009

Software. Someone brought up a good point about folders recently. They were saying that if we had folders, Amazon might have to worry about storing information on which folder the book was in when they saved your book information, so that you could re-download to the same place.

The main problems I see is trying to show folder hierarchy on such a small screen. Indenting would soon run out of room. Then, if they just had something like a header with the folder level, then showed the books in that folder, they'd be getting calls from customers complaining that their books disappeared, because they forgot that they were down a couple of levels in the folders.

Mycroft

· #5 · Feb 18, 2009

Folders could be implemented with a software update, and I don't believe that it would be too technically challenging for Amazon to develop this feature. However, I do agree that it would also have some implications for how Amazon determines where to place items and where to find them. And it would also likely increase support calls.

V

· #6 · Feb 19, 2009

It's about categorization (i.e., bookshelves) not folders or tags or other means per-se.

A browse-by-folders option would take all of 20-30 minutes to write, along with another 20-30 for an update to content manager to handle moving them around (Amazon would dump them in the main directory like it does now, no need to alter that at all). It's really a degree of shoddy implementation that this isn't there as a half-way descent developer could have a workable system in place over lunch.

Bookshelves, using a tagging system most likely since it gives the easiest flexibility, would be a bit harder but not overmuch. Two days (max) to allow both bookshelves and folder accessibility...and I know they're making enough profit off this to allocate a dev for 2 days to do this.

I can understand why they wouldn't open it up for 3rd party development but this lack of basic functionality just about cries out for some hacking.

"You can have 1,500 books! All...er...piled in the middle of the floor....good luck finding something" /sigh

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G

· #7 · Feb 19, 2009

As I understand it, the Kindle uses Linux. It's an open-source OS that naturally supports directories (folders). I'm surprised some programmer hasn't already come up with a "folder" mod.

Gruntman

· #8 · Feb 19, 2009

Bacardi Jim said:
As I understand it, the Kindle uses Linux. It's an open-source OS that naturally supports directories (folders). I'm surprised some programmer hasn't already come up with a "folder" mod.

I would be worried about using a mod, wouldn't it be likely to void the warranty?

G

· #9 · Feb 19, 2009

Gruntman said:
I would be worried about using a mod, wouldn't it be likely to void the warranty?

Yes. It almost certainly would. However, I'm still surprised that nobody's created one yet.

They certainly aren't worried about creating mods with attachments that virus my computer with Trojan Horses.

Gruntman

· #10 · Feb 19, 2009

Bacardi Jim said:
Yes. It almost certainly would. However, I'm still surprised that nobody's created one yet.

Maybe it is simply harder than we all assume.

John Steinbeck

· #11 · Feb 19, 2009

Gruntman said:
Maybe it is simply harder than we all assume.

I think bc it doesn't have enough market penetration....hackers are working on the iphone and other devices that are out there by the millions.

Jeff

· #12 · Feb 19, 2009

Writing the modification might be fairly simple but the Kindle almost certainly does some kind of security CRC check before enabling the update function and running an uploaded binary file.

Gruntman

· #13 · Feb 19, 2009

Good point, the update feature allows amazon to run defacto checks of the software your Kindle is running.

Jeff

· #14 · Feb 19, 2009

Gruntman said:
Good point, the update feature allows amazon to run defacto checks of the software your Kindle is running.

You're quite right of source, but I was actually considering how one might install a patch to the OS when there is no command line. As we've recently noted, the manual update process copies a binary file to the root then the OS recognizes it and enabled the update function. That's the only way I could think of.

EDIT: Before some Mod jumps me, I'm not suggesting a method of hacking the Kindle; just discussing why a hack to create folders isn't likely.

G

· #15 · Feb 19, 2009

Hrrrmmmm.... at least I got the experts thinking about it.

John Steinbeck

· #16 · Feb 19, 2009

Bacardi Jim said:
Hrrrmmmm.... at least I got the experts thinking about it.

Google "Kindle Hack" there is a lot out there...most revolve around all the command shortcuts and the drm structure

G

· #17 · Feb 19, 2009

J. Steinbeck said:
Google "Kindle Hack" there is a lot out there...most revolve around all the command shortcuts and the drm structure

Of course they want to hack the DRM structure. Nobody under the age of 30 who owns a computer thinks they should have to pay for anything else.

Jeff

· #18 · Feb 19, 2009

Bacardi Jim said:
Of course they want to hack the DRM structure. Nobody under the age of 30 who owns a computer thinks they should have to pay for anything else.

Yikes. I was just typing almost the same thing but you posted before I finished. That's scary. Glad you type faster (and better) than I do.

Edited to correct bad typing.

G

· #19 · Feb 19, 2009

Jeff said:
Yikes. I was just typing almost the same thing but you posted before I finished. That's scary. Glad you type faster (and better) than I do.

Edited to correct bad typing.

Consider it a rare and welcome meeting of the minds.

John Steinbeck

· #20 · Feb 19, 2009

Bacardi Jim said:
Of course they want to hack the DRM structure. Nobody under the age of 30 who owns a computer thinks they should have to pay for anything else.

I certainly don't agree with pirating/stealing of copyright materials....however, I think it is time for consumers to fight back. I think if I buy the use or rights to listen/view such material, I shouldn't have to repurchase it over and over and over again over the course of my lifetime. Examples: Sgt Peppers on vinyl, then on 8 track, then cassette, then CD, then DRM'd digital. OR Star Wars on beta max, then VHS, then Blue-Ray, then digital drm. That is a huge scam on the part of the industries involved. Heck, if I owned a huge share of the music industry market I would be changing formats every 5 years and reap the benefits.

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